Dealer Code Question
 

I am currently documenting a '65 convertible with factory 4spd/tripower for the registry. It has the following dealer code: "07 631". When I look at the available dealer code info, it indicates Pontiac Motor Division Store in Pontiac, MI. Can anyone confirm this dealer code? Did Pontiac have a factory outlet in Pontiac?

Thanks! Bill

Correct. Otherwise known as the "Pontiac Retail Store" in Pontiac, Michigan.

My neighbor (now passed away) used to work there.

K

Original Pontiac Retail Store in downtown Pontiac.

Currently in use as artists studios.

The block that you see at the top is a freight elevator that could be used to shuttle cars between floors.

K

(Eric White photos)
http://www.whitehouse-graphics.com/i...il_wrecker.jpg

http://www.whitehouse-graphics.com/i...helevation.jpg


http://www.whitehouse-graphics.com/i...ail_street.jpg


http://www.whitehouse-graphics.com/i...l_swcorner.jpg


http://www.whitehouse-graphics.com/i...televation.jpg

Keith,

Very cool old brick building with an awesome Pontiac history!

Thanks for sharing those photos.

Just curious...Why would I purchase a car at the factory outlet versus local dealer? Were they cheaper? Could I still special order a new car? I can't imagine that the local dealers were too happy about having a factory outlet store in the neighborhood. Bill

Good Gosh Keith!!!,...I mean, all the contributions and pics you share with us is so amazing that if I had anything left to perhaps think that I might be adding to any positive points of discussion of said topic seems a waste of time!..sorry,my meds kicked in, again,I want to thank you for so much unselfish factoids!!

Thank you, and you are welcome. I should add that the "modern era" Retail Store was farther north on Woodward, on the east side of the "loop" north of M59/Huron Street (65 University Drive). It was torn down in the summer of 2009 or 2010 or so.

It was provided to serve as a retail delivery service for Pontiac employees. I don't know if the general public (or employees, for that matter) could order cars through the retail store, or if they could only pick up existing vehicles or used/expensed engineering cars. But yes, they were purchased at a discount.

I can't imagine that the Pontiac dealers had too much to complain about, since the Pontiac assembly plant was their bread and butter. Discounts are still available today to GM employees when they make a new vehicle purchase.

K

Here's the original location, for comparison:

So - with all the discussion about the Retail store I forgot to opine: This is cool!

I would love to have a car that came from one of the engineering or retail dealer codes.

I put together this list from Pete's book of the dealer codes which received '63 Super Duty Catalinas. I think it is a pretty comprehensive list of "special" dealer codes that have ties to the factory.

K

Keith, I think a lot of those dealer codes are known now.

Here's a couple photos of the Pontiac Retail Store. One is from 1958, and the other is from nearly the same angle, circa 2000. Also a cool matchbook I found at the Pontiac-Oakland Museum.

Mike

http://forums.maxperformanceinc.com/...1&d=1441134349

http://forums.maxperformanceinc.com/...1&d=1441134349

http://forums.maxperformanceinc.com/...1&d=1441134349

Thanks, Mike.

I saw that first pic (in a small version) but the overall coloring mistakenly made me think it was a shot of Bob Longpre.

Your second pic is the same exposure as my first picture.

If you have any of those dealer codes and could shoot them to me I would update my notes.

Thanks,

K

17-991 would have been the Zone office in Jacksonville, FL. Possibly a Company Car build.

In part, from John Wallace Dealer Code List:

08-020 Arthur Pontiac, Inc., 3077 Mayfield Rd. at Lee, Cleveland Heights, Ohio, operated at that location from 1959 to 1984 from what I can tell.
03-401 Regester's Pontiac, Inc., State Rd. & West Chester Pike, Upper Darby, PA (originally Bushong Pontiac then became Regester's Bushong Pontiac, I believe by '63 it was just known as Regester's Pontiac).
10-464 Frank Shaver Pontiac Inc., 5800 Hohman Avenue, Hammond, IN (this one is a little confusing, the Hammond store was opened in 1935 by Frank's father, Eugene Larue (known as E.L.) and I believe simply called Shaver Pontiac. Frank had Shaver Preferred Motors in East Chicago, IN from 1948. When E.L. died in May, 1960, Frank took over his father's dealership under the Frank Shaver Pontiac name. I don't know for sure if it was known as Frank Shaver Pontiac or Shaver Pontiac, but I believe the formal business name would have been Frank Shaver Pontiac, Inc.
09-649 Sam Swope Pontiac, Inc., 126 Breckenridge Lane, Louisville, KY, Swope already had been in biz as a Chrysler-Plymouth dealer, switched brands when he got the Pontiac franchise in 1961. He relocated to a brand new facility at 4311 Shelbyville Rd. in 1966 and proceeded to expand his lines, remaining at that location until the late '80s. The company remains in biz today (not sure when they gave up Pontiac). The building that Swope originally occupied is now used by an AAMCO Trans shop today along with a couple other businesses.

Well, there ya go Keith! Thank you John, once again your research has helped us all.

I'll try to add to the list:

10-529 - Welter Pontiac, Inc., 1900 Lincoln Way East, South Bend, IN
12-011 - Allen S Pontiac-Oldsmobile, 408 Liberty St, Covington, IN
24-112 - H&R Pontiac-GMC, 764 Main St, El Centro, CA
07-493 - Stan Long Pontiac, 10450 Grand River Ave, Detroit, MI
16-583 - Stephenson-Wilson Inc., 823 Morgan St, Durham, NC

I know I have 22-345 in my files. I recently ran across hundreds of dealer codes from that area of Texas, but haven't updated my spreadsheets yet.

Mike

Ha! Always enjoy seeing what I can discover.

Didn't realize there was a 2nd page.

12-011 is actually Allen's Pontiac-Oldsmobile. The Owner was Schuyler Allen and his wife Ilene., so conceivably could have incorporated as "Allen S", with the S being the initial of his first name. But I see obits of several past employees, always referring to it as Allen's Pontiac-Oldsmobile.

07-493 Jim Causley Pontiac, Inc. Note the spelling, I believe John Wallace has it misspelled. They were located at 17677 Mack, Detroit, MI in the '60s. They have relocated (and Pontiac gone) but the company is still in biz.

16-583 Stephenson-Wilson, Inc. which was dba Stephenson-Wilson Pontiac in Durham, NC. It was located at 823 Morgan St. in the early '60s. By '69, the property had been sold to another auto biz and then the building burned down around 1979.

Never noticed that one.
I corrected it but with some info.

Jim Causley Pontiac is actually zone 7 dealer #99, which I did have correct.
(and 100 and the 493)

:)

John, thanks!

With the alphabetical "convention", I have to wonder if Jim Causley (07-099 and/or 07-100) )would have acquired the additional code(s) already by 1962-1963 or if that happened later and 07-493 may have been assigned to somebody else at that time?

Any idea how early Causley obtained the 07-493 code? And which code(s) applied to the Mack Ave. address and what address for 07-493?

Keith, I'd like to correctly credit the original photographer of the modern pics displayed above. He is POCI & Michigan Widetracker chapter member Mike Woody. That is Mike's Tempest parked on the street in front of the building.

Mike was part of a POCI exploratory committee charged with identifying possible locations for a possible POCI-sponsored Pontiac-Oakland museum, possibly located in the Detroit/S.E. Michigan area. This was in the early to mid-2000s, long before Tim Dye founded the current POMARC facility in Pontiac, IL.

As I understand it, the committee was comprised of about a half dozen POCI members, including John Sawruk. They looked at a hand-full of sites, but the POCI could not pull the trigger on any further developmental commitments.

Here's a link to an early PY Forums-based, weak as it may have been, attempt to organize a formal P-O museum.

http://forums.maxperformanceinc.com/...ghlight=museum

As you may read there, my first feeble efforts were very suddenly and very ably overtaken by the current POMARC. I am still of the persuasion that a “satellite” or adjunct POMARC in the S.E. Mi area would serve to draw out a lot of local historical materials that need to be saved from the landfill.

A lot of Pontiac's history is ending up in the trash. As an example...

A local friend of mine, who is both observant and history-minded, noticed a dumpster outside of a home in his local neighborhood that had been unoccupied for some time. He kept an eye on the goings-on, and soon noticed a pile of comic books in the “bin of death.” He is not a comic collector, but is an automotive literature collector. After a day or so of no additional action (and no rain) he liberated nearly 3,000 books ranging in age from 1965-1990-ish. A day later the dumpster was gone. Here is a large pile of comics that were abandoned by someone, discarded by someone, and saved from oblivion by someone.

Can you imagine all of the historical PMD/Oakland materials that could end up the same way, saved from oblivion?

John, I think I'm missing something here. Did someone have 07-493 listed as Jim Causley Pontiac?

07-493 is Stan Long Pontiac, which fits in the alphabetical assignment of dealer codes (1967).

07-100 is Jim Causley Inc, 38111 Gratiot Ave, Mt Clemens, MI (1981)

Mike

Wow, awesome information!

Tim gets donations all the time, and you can imagine how many people bring in boxes and boxes of stuff from old Pontiac dealerships. No one had anticipated Pontiac going under when the museum was planned.

Are there any photos of the interior of the Pontiac Retail Store when it was in operation? I'm sure there's a few pics in the Pontiac Museum, just haven't run across them yet.

I agree with Mike Noun (as my father-in law bought a couple of cars from Jim Causley, ((when he was located on Mack Avenue in Detroit (on the East Side). Today they are on Gratiot Avenue right before "Downtown" Mt Clemens as you are going North on Gratiot Avenue.

Jim Causley made the move out of Detroit well before Olds and Pontiac went under.

Tom V.

Mike, what do you show for Priehs Sales Pontiac?
Or John Rummel Pontiac?

Need to do some more corrections probably.

Also do you have Causley as dealer number 099?
This had the address: 17677 Mack Ave Detroit

What was the actual address of the place the pics were taken at?

:confused:

Still after all these years, no full dealership codes.

:(

John, I'm sorry, I don't have anything for Priehs Pontiac.

I update my spreadsheet almost daily as I find new invoices from various sources. I also add new codes, correct addresses, etc. from invoices and build sheets that people send me to create a window sticker. I've added a few hundred, but there's still a lot of gaps. Sadly, PHS won't even share dealer names anymore. So if you paid $65 for a crappy, barely readable copy of a 1967 Billing History Card, they want $50 to disclose the name of a dealership. For someone who dumpster-dove those invoices decades ago, it's made them millions of dollars, and they have Pontiac fans over a barrel.

Jim Causley had two codes, the 07-099 was 17677 Mack Ave in Detroit, and 07-100 was 38111 Gratiot Ave in Mt. Clemens.

I've run across dozens and dozens of examples where a dealer had two codes, numerically next to each other, usually with the same address. When the addresses are different, most likely the dealership moved at some point. When I update my spreadsheet, I always include the year and model of the car where I obtained the info. That helps to determine when the move occurred.

But many examples show a dealer with two codes, one having the street address, the other with a P.O. Box. This may have been something to do with billing. Perhaps they used one address for financed cars, the other for purchased cars, I'm not sure.

There's also examples of a dealer address being shared by multiple dealers, and I believe those addresses are for a Zone lot.

Mike

Mike,
Do you have any info on a dealer code 19611?

I've checked before on some website but it didn't show this number on the list.


.

Mike, I crossed up 07-493 using John W's (johnta1) decoder.

And didn't go back to see you had already id'd that one as Stan Long.

John, I see you added the Stan Long identification. Wondering if you shouldn't delete Jim Causley for that code?

I also see that you might have pulled that ID from Sean Mattingly's site, he also has it with the same misspelling as Jim Clausey (sic).

John, I went thru your notes about Priehs also. This is where time frames become important. I seem to recall learning on the PY Forum that PMD may have issued new Dealer Codes at some point. In that case, 07-493 for Jim Causley may be completely unrelated to the Dealer Code list that existed in the '60s and '70s. Something to consider.

Mike, I believe one explanation for a Dealer having two codes is that some Dealers had an inventory lot location separate from the Dealer's Sales location.

I believe sometimes those dealers shipped cars to the inventory lot, other times to the Sales location.

For purposes of Billing, the Sales address was used.

On those occasions when they wanted a car delivered to the inventory lot, the "SHIP TO" would identify the alternate Dealer Code. On the '69 Invoices you will see a section labeled "SHIPPED TO - SAME (UNLESS OTHERWISE INDICATED)".

Zone Stock builds, common in '69, would show a Zone location "dealer" code.

But a Dealer ordered build might also show a different code for the Dealer being invoiced for the car if he wanted it delivered to his remote inventory location.

On the '65 BHC's there are boxes for the "CHARGE TO" Dealer code and the "SHIP TO" Dealer code for the same purpose. If the same, the "SHIP TO" Box is blank.

Never seen a '65 BHC with a "SHIP TO" code. But I assume it is possible and likely some examples exist.

Mike, it is good that you are tracking the time frames for the Dealer addresses.

It seems many dealers moved out of the downtowns in the '60s and '70s. And many suburban locations changed too as biz grew. Hard to track when they moved.

I'm wondering if Jim Causley, Inc. was assigned BOTH 07-099 and 07-100 BEFORE moving out of Detroit? Could have been true if he had a separate inventory lot location.

Reason I'm wondering this, I believe most times when a Dealer relocated, he kept his Dealer Code. I know I have seen examples where that was true.

Unless he operated for a time at both the old and new locations, it doesn't seem logical to me that he would have been assigned a new code just because he changed addresses.

It seems to me, he might have had both Dealer codes for the Detroit operation, then when he moved, might have only retained the one, figuring he no longer needed a separate inventory lot location.

Just thinking out loud I guess that the "original" address for 07-100 may have been in Detroit, connected to his Mack Ave. business.

John, I found some info about Priehs Motor Sales Co.

It was formed by Frank Priehs and his brother Louis in 1920. They bought the property at 103 Macomb St. in Mt. Clemens from their father, a livery stable located there.

Originally had Cadillac, Buick, and LaSalle franchises. In 1925, Frank bought out his brother. In 1928, he bought a large vacant lot next door and used it for a used car lot (presumably accounting for the address as 95-103 Macomb St.). "His dealership lasted for many years, finally being sold and divided" following the death of Frank Priehs in 1963. No mention of when they got the Pontiac dealership. Or when it got sold.

zimtok, Zone 19 is the Memphis, TN zone. But that Zone covered a lot of area. Do you have any idea where it was sold or any clues? Mike might have it on his list but if not, would help if you knew what city or anything else. What car is this for, model year?

I few comments: Jim Causley was a dedicated PONTIAC DEALERSHIP on Mack Avenue in Detroit. His Code 07-099 would have been the Pontiac code.

When things started getting bad on the east side of Detroit (former location of 95% of the Police and Fireman homes in Detroit when they were required to live in Detroit), Jim Causley purchased the Olds/Buick/GMC dealership on Gratiot Avenue. When Olds was dropped as a Brand, the Gratiot location picked up some Pontiac Business therefore the 07-100 number was probably added at that time for that location. (To sell Pontiac Vehicles there and at the 07-099 location in Detroit.) The dealerships were far enough apart to justify a separate dealer code for each location. When times got really tough in Detroit, Causley hung on selling Pontiacs and stayed at the Detroit location until Pontiac went down the tube. At that point, the 07-100 code would have been dropped but the 07-493 (assumed to be for the Buick/GMC Truck side of the business) would show up on the list for Jim Causley.

Tom V.

John, I too had thought that a dealer having two codes may mean they had a storage lot.

Also interesting is how many invoices I've seen where one invoice uses a P.O. Box for an address, another (from the same dealer) used the dealer's full address. I haven't investigated the reasoning behind that. My first thought was that dealers had two codes for accounting purposes.

Zimtok, I'm sorry, I don't have that dealer code.

Earlier question about the Pontiac Retail Store location, the address was 65 University Drive, Pontiac MI.

Mike

Tom, great info.

Found a neat ad in a Michigan Opera Threatre program booklet that seems to have been published around late summer, early fall of 1976 (for their '76-'77 season).

Contains an ad for the Tri-County Pontiac Dealers (Detroit area).

Notice that the Gratiot Ave. dealership in Mt. Clemens was Randy Wood Pontiac-GMC, Inc. at that time.

Not sure when Jim Causley took over that biz location. And not sure if Randy Wood was the guy that took over from Priehs Pontiac, John W., aby idea about that?

But Causley's Mack Ave. dealership was also listed.

And I agree, if both locations were operating, PMD would have assigned a Dealer Code to each. Also, new Dealer Codes were issued when ownership changed at a location. SO I assume each owner from Priehs on got their own unique Dealer Code even if they did business at the same location as the prior Owner.

John, that's a great ad! I remember Art Moran Pontiac on Telegraph Road. There was a large Chrysler Dealership, where I saw my first Plymouth Superbird, and Roger Penske Chevrolet, all within about 1/2 mile of each other.

Packer Pontiac had a location in Detroit, then used the same dealer code (07-607) for a location in Pontiac (perhaps they moved), then a second code (07-608) for the same address in Pontiac.

I believe Packer Pontiac moved out of Detroit in 1974 based on this post by a mechanic who worked for Packer Pontiac:

"Packer Pontiac was at 18650 Livernois, south of Seven Mile. I worked there 71-72.

(I) Went in with a inventory crew after Palmer Pontiac closed in '90 or '91.

It felt strange, it still looked the same inside. In fact, in the showroom you could still see painted on the wall to the Service Department "America's Largest Pontiac Dealer".

The Packers owned three, the others were in Miami and in Flint. Packer advertised and painted on the showroom windows,"Detroit, I'm Here For Good" in '72 due to dealers moving to the 'burbs. A couple of years later, he followed."

So that is what I base my 1974 Packer "Move Out of Detroit" info on, Mike.

Tom V.

One more comment about the 07-493 code.

I mentioned earlier that I thought I recalled learning that Pontiac issued all new Dealer Codes at some point.

Tom, you could be right that this was a Buick code for Jim Causley.

But I'm thinking since they continued as a Pontiac dealer to the very end, it is just as likely that 07-493 was the Pontiac code assignment after the old dealer codes were abandoned.

Anybody have any info to comfirm what I'm vaguely remembering about all new codes being issued to all Pontiac dealers at some point?

My uncle had his Dealerships / code assignments until after his passing and a different dealer took over his location. Not aware that his numbers ever changed John.

Tom V.

I know that in 1967 they changed the 01 zone (which was Canada) to zone 81.

Not sure if they re-did all of them, but don't think so.

Also seems like in the 80's they changed the codes for all the plants, more like GM than just Pontiac or Buick, chevy, etc?

:)

Definitely not before 1980 because I bought a new Pontiac that year from Haggerty Pontiac in Villa Park, Ill and they had the same Dealer Code as from the '60s as I recall it.

Tom, when was the latest your uncle had his code?

If the codes changed, I thought it might have been in the late '80s or even the '90s.

Can't say for sure, but I thought it was a retired GM guy that mentioned it in a thread here some years ago.

Don't know why else I'm remembering that possibility.

Well John, my cousin says that the Pontiac Dealership number never changed from the time my Uncle opened the Pontiac "store" (he had several "stores") until she sold the businesses in 1999. He was in the game for 67 years.

My cousin ran the dealerships for 7 years after my uncle's passing.

Tom V.

Don’t mean to hijack this topic but with all the comments regarding Jim Causley Pontiac I thought that I’d chime in with what I remember.

My first time at Jim Causley Pontiac was when my father bought a new 1964 Star Chief from him at his dealership located at 17677 Mack Ave in Detroit. At that time all he sold was Pontiacs. I believe the salesman name was Bill Koch.

Starting in the early 70’s I was in and out of there somewhat often. Sometime in the early to mid-1970’s Causley added a GMC franchise. The trucks were kept at a second location about one block north on Mack Ave. The service center for them was built large enough to accommodate the GMC motorhomes that were manufactured from 1973 to 1978.

I ordered and purchased a new 1977 Grand Prix SJ from Causley in September 1976 at the Mack Ave location. Salesman’s name was John Fennessey and the General Manager was Ray Laethem. I recently found an old folder containing the original hand written sales order form and copies of repair orders for that car. Sorry no dealer codes on any of them.

At this time there was another Pontiac dealer called Randy Wood that was located on Gratiot Ave north of Metro Parkway (a.k.a. 16 mile rd.) in Clinton Township, MI. Sometime later Jim Causley purchased Randy Wood Pontiac and changed the name to James Pontiac and gave it to his son James (Jr?) to run. Can’t remember when GMC got added to the location. In 1980 Jim Causley sold his Mack Ave dealership (Pontiac/GMC) to his General Manager Ray Laethem. The dealership is still there and before Pontiac went away it added a Buick franchise. Ray Laethem passed away in 2010 and I believe his son now runs it. Today it’s a Buick/GMC franchise and they also have a Chrysler/Jeep/Ram dealership up the street and it is also named Ray Laethem. As for Jim Causley he took over what was then called James Pontiac/GMC and sent his son James to run a dealership in Port Huron or Saint Clair Michigan. Seem to remember it was a Chevrolet/Oldsmobile store. Causley then changed the name of the Gratiot Ave dealership from James to Jim Causley Pontiac/GMC.

Sometime later Jim Causley brought his son James back to Clinton Township and gave him a dealership down Gratiot Ave that was called Bernie Hout Chevrolet (formerly Ernie Grissom Chevrolet) to run. Under Causley the name was changed to James Chevrolet.

Jim Causley passed away in February 2003 at age 73 and around that time James Chevrolet got sold and became Moran Chevrolet. Don’t know what happened to Causley’s son James. Jim Causley Pontiac/GMC dealership on Gratiot Ave still exists and is run by one of his other sons (Rob?). When Pontiac Division went away they picked up a Buick franchise. So as of now it’s called Jim Causley Buick/GMC.

As for how many dealer codes Jim Causley Pontiac had and what they were I don’t know. It’s probably safe to say that he had a Pontiac dealer code and a GMC dealer code while located on Mack Ave in Detroit. But after that who knows. For what it’s worth I’ve heard many times that Jim Causley owned more than just the dealers I’ve listed here.

Even thought the Money came from the same place (Jim Causley), unless he put the actual ownership paperwork in one of his sons hands and they received a new Dealer Code it would seem that Jim Causley had a Dealer number for each store he actually owned. He would have kept that number until his passing.

My Uncle over the years owned a Cadillac dealership, a GMC Dealership, a Pontiac Dealership, and until Olds went under a Olds dealership. He owned a Buick dealership for a period of time (purchased from a deceased owner's wife) but quickly sold it to another Buick dealer so that he did not have to acquire a unique number for that store.

If you had the funds you could own multiple stores of different GM Brands.
Today the stores (Locations) are allowed to even carry off shore inventory at the same location.

Ford did that deal with some Ford/Mazda locations

Tom V.

Thanks for the information, 1969GiPper.

:)

Finally found the thread that talked about the renumbering of Pontiac Dealer Codes.

See Transamric's post #22.

Rereading that post now, I think I realize my error trying to interpret this.

Looks like PMD consolidated a few Zones at some point.

So by Aug. 1990, Ric had learned that new Dealer Code assignments were made for the new Zone 23. In the consolidation, this new Zone took on parts of the old Zone 23 (SF), Zone 24 (LA), and Zone 25 (Seattle).

Dealers in the new Zone 23 were given new Dealer Codes and they were NOT in alphabetical order.

At the time, I jumped to the conclusion that ALL Pontiac dealers received new codes in ALL Zones.

But with Tom explaining that his Uncle had the same Dealer code thru 1999, I now believe that the renumbering only occurred where Zone offices were consolidated.

Don't know where else that happened but I assume not all Zones were affected by consolidation and dealers in those unaffected Zones had no reason to get new Dealer Codes.

Here is the old thread that you can review and interpret for yourself. Curious to know if anybody knows anything more about PMD Zone office consolidations elsewhere.

http://forums.maxperformanceinc.com/...d.php?t=587105

Revisiting this old thread for a couple reasons:

a) As I have mentioned, when I retired I had to forfeit my laptop without much notice, so I lost all my photos, emails and excel spreadsheets. As a result, I have been attempting to rebuild my various databases as I find things that I had previously posted.

b) After finding my dealer code list, I took this opportunity to update my data based on the info in this thread. I was able to cut the list of "unknowns" about in half.

Updated Super Duty list attached below, now sorted by zone and dealer. Facilities associated with PMD are highlighted in yellow.

I think it's a pretty cool list of probably special dealers who received very special cars.

K

http://forums.maxperformanceinc.com/...1&d=1584642909

Cool list!

:)


I have Bob Cutts as 04 119 Bob Cutts Pontiac PO Box 957 Salem VA 24153

I have 04 479 as Woodson Pontiac Inc PO Box 5495 3926 Williamson Rd N.W. Roanoke VA

And this is what I have for Packer and Knafel:

07 607 Packer Pontiac 18650 Livernois Detroit MI
07 608 Packer Pontiac 500 South Opdyke Road Pontiac MI 48057

08 197 Knafel Pontiac Inc 956 S Main St Akron OH 44311


:)

Woodson is a much better fit for the #479 slot


The car sold at Brushy Mountain in NC was most likely used for moonshine.
Do they have a listing of equipment for each car - like axle gear ratio ?

Packer, MT, Vanke, Beswick, Union Park and Pete Seaton all got their (Swiss Cheese) cars through the PMD Engineering code 35-997. It does not appear Knapfel got a car.

No - it's the list from Pete's book.

It might show if the car got the aluminum package vs steel sheet metal, or 8 lugs, but that's about it.

K

Don't know if you've found any more of the missing below since your post, but here's a few I had~

04 029 : Jack Blank Pontiac, 1437 Irving St Northwest, Washington DC
source: '65 build sheet

08 381 : Cal Wible Pontiac, 321 South Court St (in '70), Medina OH
source unknown

10 183 : Franklin-Weber Motors, 6101-25 North Clark St, Chicago IL
source: '65 build sheet

Thank you; I'll make the updates.

K

Back to the top; with updates.

K

https://forums.maxperformanceinc.com...1&d=1732301919

Interesting thread. I worked at a Pontiac dealership from 1983 to 1990. Our dealer code did change during this time, I think toward the end of my time there maybe 88 or 89. The location did not change and I dont believe the ownership changed. I worked in the parts department and saved a lot of stuff. I will see if I can narrow the date down with what I have. Our code was 315102, I think that was the original code but dont remember what the new code was. Could have been a zone consolidation as mentioned earlier in the thread. Found some more info. By the beginning of 1989 our dealer code was now 315017. This was Brookdale Pontiac in the Twin Cities of Minnesota. Owned by Rudy Luther, the name was R.L. Brookdale motors.

Didn't the
I think the change in numbers was the fact they went from Brookdale Pontiac to Brookdale Motor Sales. Don't remember the R.L. attachment to the name.

GM / Pontiac revamped their dealer code system in '87. Dealers after that usually fell outside the alphabetized system used previously, and some zones were consolidated into others; Zone 11 is one of those : it continued, but new dealers after '87 were put into Zone 10.

R L Brookdale Motors did have 2 numbers : 15 102 & 15 017. 102 was sourced off a '79 build sheet and it 'right' alphabetically. 017 came from '90 documents, and has it sitting in the 'And--' section.

Dealers who had no name / location / ownership changes kept their pre-87 numbers until such happened- no one was automatically renumbered. R L Brookdale must have had something change in ownership.

Just added 07 - 773 to the Wallace list

1965 GTO (current dragcar) originally purchased at

Stuart Auto Company

Chesaning, Michigan

Do not know of any history, possibly a Chevrolet dealership now at a different location?

Stuart was @ 142 North Saginaw St, which is this small storefront: