[slowbird]

Originally Posted by johnta1

You brought up the "#2" .

The data for the #1 shows what he said.
The MPH HP shows what the dyno said, the ET is off because he hasn't got the car lined out.



Yours is basically the same setup.
(if the numbers/data is correct)

Your dyno showed 1030 HP?
The car shows 1040 HP by the ET.
But the MPH shows more HP than the dyno.

So either your dyno is off or your data is off.

Wow!
Et is off because 60ft is crap, 1.26 60ft. That is why you ALWAYS use mph to figure hp.
So again if you believe 1100hp is achievable based on 1/8 mph (which you say there is nothing wrong with the calculation) with HP heads and a Victor intake and only 511ci. Why would any not go to Dan Barton? KRE can only get 1075hp with a 541, sheetmetal intake and 2 fours. Why choose them?

[Aaron Quinton]

1025 HP – 2650 lbs = 7.92 @ 170 Pickett Wagon

1034 HP – 2150 lbs. = 7.36 @ 184 Campolucci GTO

Both sets of HP's were done by KRE.

I'm really not sure how all of this is helping the guy asking for input on HP's. I'm out.

Originally Posted by slowbird

Some facts for you,
Car #1 dynos around 1030hp runs 5.4@129 weighs 2900lbs, has ladder bars, tunnel ram and 2 carbs
Car #2 dynos around 1030hp runs 5.43@128 weighs 3300lbs, stock suspension, victor intake and 1 carb
What conclusion do you draw?
Can you show me a 1000+hp kre that shows it on the track?

[gene simmons]

Originally Posted by Aaron Quinton

1025 HP – 2650 lbs = 7.92 @ 170 Pickett Wagon

1034 HP – 2150 lbs. = 7.36 @ 184 Campolucci GTO

Both sets of HP's were done by KRE.

I'm really not sure how all of this is helping the guy asking for input on HP's. I'm out.

Isn't Picketts wagon running Warp6 heads? I am not sure what stallion was running.

[tom s]

the wagon ran Warp 6 the last 2 Norwalks,hiports the year before.Tom

[mike leech]

Originally Posted by Aaron Quinton

1025 HP – 2650 lbs = 7.92 @ 170 Pickett Wagon

1034 HP – 2150 lbs. = 7.36 @ 184 Campolucci GTO

Both sets of HP's were done by KRE.

I'm really not sure how all of this is helping the guy asking for input on HP's. I'm out.

And the wagon went how fast the same weekend as car 2 went a 8.5x???????

8.39 at 2700!!!!!!!!

That proves slobirds point!

[LiL Jack]

Originally Posted by gene simmons

Isn't Picketts wagon running Warp6 heads? I am not sure what stallion was running.

Yes he was but why let facts get in the way.

[tom s]

Mike,I think the wagon weighs more like 2825-2850 when he runs the HU race.He takes out weight when he runs the east coast circuit.Tom

[mike leech]

Originally Posted by tom s

Mike,I think the wagon weighs more like 2825-2850 when he runs the HU race.He takes out weight when he runs the east coast circuit.Tom

Ok. Say 2800. Vs 3350 and Same hp supposedly. 500lbs is not .20

Period.

[slowbird]

Originally Posted by Aaron Quinton

1025 HP – 2650 lbs = 7.92 @ 170 Pickett Wagon

1034 HP – 2150 lbs. = 7.36 @ 184 Campolucci GTO

Both sets of HP's were done by KRE.

I'm really not sure how all of this is helping the guy asking for input on HP's. I'm out.

I think this has been very helpful.
According to Johnta1 math its possible to make 1130hp from HP heads and a Victor intake which is 2.21hp/ci. Pretty impressive i think. Math never lies, right? And KRE's dyno is not to be questioned, everyone elses dyno is off.
I learned a lot today.

[johnta1]

Pretty impressive i think. Math never lies, right?

I think this is the pertinent point!

Your data is fubarred!

Maybe you should reweigh your car?

[slowbird]

Originally Posted by johnta1

I think this is the pertinent point!

Your data is fubarred!

Maybe you should reweigh your car?

Lol i ran Tom's heads up race. It was weighed after every pass. So i guess Norwalk scales are off now?
Maybe your hp equation needs work? But that would mean car#1 no longer matches KRE dyno.

[LiL Jack]

Originally Posted by slowbird

Lol i ran Tom's heads up race. It was weighed after every pass. So i guess Norwalk scales are off now?
Maybe your hp equation needs work? But that would mean car#1 no longer matches KRE dyno.

Norwalk scales were dead nuts on with mine and my dads car.

[johnta1]

Lol i ran Tom's heads up race. It was weighed after every pass. So i guess Norwalk scales are off now?

Cool.

What was your 1/4 mile ET and MPH there?

[slowbird]

Originally Posted by johnta1

Cool.

What was your 1/4 mile ET and MPH there?

Best mph at Norwalk was 156.5 car weighed 3330lbs. You calculator shows 1024hp. A car weighing 2900lbs will need to run 164 to be close to that hp. Most cars at this level gain 29-30mph on back half.
I realize you'll never concede that your 1/8 cal is jacked up or that the kre dyno is generous so all this is pointless.

[Aaron Quinton]

I know 0 about Johnta1's math. Agree that math does not lie if completed by a competent person.

I did not say KRE's dyno was not to be questioned, you are twisting words. What I was getting at was what data you personally have from their dyno and the track that is counter to theirs. You have none.

The data I provided was experience from KRE on their pump vs. performance. I did not say anything about car set up, air, 60', or anything else. You filled in the blanks with assumptions based on your biases. If you have questions, call KRE and ask them. I was just trying to help.

All I was trying to do is to share my personal experience based on the question asked about KRE high ports. I did not say anyone was better than anyone else or assume that the question asked was based on who can provide the highest HP NA engine, highest HP Juice engine, etc.

I'm not sure why this topic has people rev'd up but I can see why folks would not post here based on all back biting, chest beating and drama.

To the person posting the original topic, I hope your successful with your build and your selection in head porter/engine builder. Good luck!

Originally Posted by slowbird

I think this has been very helpful.
According to Johnta1 math its possible to make 1130hp from HP heads and a Victor intake which is 2.21hp/ci. Pretty impressive i think. Math never lies, right? And KRE's dyno is not to be questioned, everyone elses dyno is off.
I learned a lot today.

[Skip Fix]

I think the point Slowbird is trying to make is all calculators and "math" have some bias in the formula or "programming". Plug the same data in different engine sim programs and see if you get the same answer. Some add different amounts for a solid vs a hydraulic vs a roller cam, some an exact amount of HP regardless of the motor. My higher end Dynomation wanted around a 118 LS for my 500 IA motor and I have all the flow numbers, port lengths etc added in. Don't think too many Pontiac guys running NA are using 118 LS on their motors.

If you ever used the old Quarter Jr. program there were lots of different tweaks in the program to try and get the estimate to match a real run.

My own car has run different 1/8 vs 1/4 where it it not the same multiplication factor to get the 1/4 mile et from the 1/8-so the math did "lie" if only one 1.52 or 1.55 is the "correct" one.

And lots of "generous" and "conservative" dynos out there-like flow benches. Few are really going to give the same exact numbers on the same engine even corrected for weather conditions. Ones that "run the number" are a little more to be believed-but unless it is your own how do you know. The Dyno my pump gas motor was run on was actually 25-40 HP less than the mph/hp calculators show. Some math is wrong there either the dynos or the calculators.

But as Aaron said all this is a slight side track to the original question-several folks out there have done multiple High Ports probably all different prices if price is a concern. Pick one you feel will match your engine and project goals and go for it.

[slowbird]

Also back to the original topic, it doesnt matter how good the heads are if you don't have the intake ported to go with it. And i'm not just talking about port matched and plenum blending either.

[Steve C.]

When we first built the 526 engine (4.315 bore / 4.5 stroke) with the HP heads we did two intake manifolds for it. A Victor intake and a BOP intake. On the first dyno session we tested both intakes and found the BOP intake made about 8-10 more horsepower. The Victor intake made peak power at 7000 rpm and with the BOP intake peak power was at 7300/7400 rpm. With the little hp differance we use the Victor intake rather than at a higher rpm with the BOP intake. Now that said it is a nitrous only set up and we have only gone to the expense of setting up the fogger system for the Victor intake. If we were to do so for the BOP intake it might be a differant situation, but we have never done so.


.

[Stan Weiss]

Originally Posted by Skip Fix

I think the point Slowbird is trying to make is all calculators and "math" have some bias in the formula or "programming". Plug the same data in different engine sim programs and see if you get the same answer. Some add different amounts for a solid vs a hydraulic vs a roller cam, some an exact amount of HP regardless of the motor. My higher end Dynomation wanted around a 118 LS for my 500 IA motor and I have all the flow numbers, port lengths etc added in. Don't think too many Pontiac guys running NA are using 118 LS on their motors.

If you ever used the old Quarter Jr. program there were lots of different tweaks in the program to try and get the estimate to match a real run.

My own car has run different 1/8 vs 1/4 where it it not the same multiplication factor to get the 1/4 mile et from the 1/8-so the math did "lie" if only one 1.52 or 1.55 is the "correct" one.

And lots of "generous" and "conservative" dynos out there-like flow benches. Few are really going to give the same exact numbers on the same engine even corrected for weather conditions. Ones that "run the number" are a little more to be believed-but unless it is your own how do you know. The Dyno my pump gas motor was run on was actually 25-40 HP less than the mph/hp calculators show. Some math is wrong there either the dynos or the calculators.

But as Aaron said all this is a slight side track to the original question-several folks out there have done multiple High Ports probably all different prices if price is a concern. Pick one you feel will match your engine and project goals and go for it.

Skip,
Another reason et and MPH numbers do not match the dyno HP numbers is when someone is running a hood scoop. Who has dynoed with a fan blowing whatever MPH air they run into the carb(s)?

Stan

[mike leech]

Originally Posted by Stan Weiss

Skip,
Another reason et and MPH numbers do not match the dyno HP numbers is when someone is running a hood scoop. Who has dynoed with a fan blowing whatever MPH air they run into the carb(s)?

Stan

Or when you have this.....1 3/4"