[phoenixgraphix]

Originally Posted by The Boss

Are there any plans to reproduce the stripes as they were originally or will they continue to be made the way they always have been?



http://forums.maxperformanceinc.com/...d.php?t=732300

The stripe you are showing as a NOS stripe with a pinstripe is where the pink silk screened color is actually overlapping the orange. The colors are individual and should not overlap. We corrected this issue by making sure the colors did not overlap when they are silk screened. Thank you for your question.

[gtohurstjudge]

I have a question for Phoenix Graphix........I have seen your Judge stripes
on 69's (not your current ones but stripes from ten years ago, and the width of the three
colors was not uniform from door to fender and from door to quarter. On one panel the
yellow was too wide and on the adjacent panel the yellow was too narrow creating a mismatch where they joined. The factory Pontiac stripes were like this as well and I always
thought this made the stripes look terrible. I have stripes from Year One on my 69 that were
made by Dale's Cuda Shop and the widths of the three colors on the stripe are perfectly
uniform. Also on the DCS stripes I have, the two inside colors are printed on top of yellow
film, so that the yellow edge is all the way through the material, making it impossible
for the edge to wear off and turn white. This happened to factory Pontiac stripes when
they were only a couple of years old. I've had many people who own 69 Judges go nuts
over my stripes because they are so perfectly uniform and don't have white edges. How do
the stripes that you are making at present compare regarding the two issues I mentioned?
Someone told me recently that DCS doesn't make Judge stripes for Year One anymore but I haven't checked to verify that is true.

[gto4evr]

Originally Posted by gtohurstjudge

........ the width of the three
colors was not uniform from door to fender and from door to quarter. On one panel the
yellow was too wide and on the adjacent panel the yellow was too narrow creating a mismatch where they joined. The factory Pontiac stripes were like this as well .

This is the first I've heard of this. So the factory stripes wandered in width on 69s? I paid $225 for a set of stripes from the Paddock back in 1987 (receipt's still in the box) and they were supposedly NOS stripes repackaged in one box from what I recall the sales rep saying, never had a reason to doubt that back then since the wheel moldings I bought for my 69 from them were NOS in the GM wrappers. A few years ago I noticed the color widths on the decals weren't uniform like the Judge stripes I put on my vert from Year One back in 06 so I proceeded to flip out knowing I had to replace them for a better quality and that $225 I spent 27 years ago which translates to probably $500 nowadays was wasted. Now this new statement about the width has me questioning whether maybe they are NOS. The backing says 3M Scotchcal, just like the set of NOS decals with boxes that are on ebay right now. Is that evidence enough, or was it just that repop places happened to be able to use the same adhesive because 3M still made it? Were they repopping these decals in 1987? No matter how hard I stare at those pictures on the ebay auction, I can't tell if my eyes are playing tricks on me as far as the widths. I can see it plain as day on what's in front of me though.

http://www.ebay.com/itm/NOS-1969-GTO...8e9b98&vxp=mtr

and just for clarification, the decals are still in the box, not on a car, it's been 27 years and counting and I still haven't gotten around to restoring this car yet!

[The Boss]

Originally Posted by phoenixgraphix

The stripe you are showing as a NOS stripe with a pinstripe is where the pink silk screened color is actually overlapping the orange. The colors are individual and should not overlap. We corrected this issue by making sure the colors did not overlap when they are silk screened. Thank you for your question.

So I should read that as "We will continue to produce the stripes in the manner we believe GM intended them." rather than "we will produce the stripes the way GM produced them"?

[gto4evr]

Originally Posted by The Boss

So I should read that as "We will continue to produce the stripes in the manner we believe GM intended them." rather than "we will produce the stripes the way GM produced them"?

My thoughts exactly! Comparing those two pictures, that NOS stripe looks MUCH nicer than the reproduction stripe. The overlap defines the color change between the orange and pink stripe and makes the overall appearance much crisper.

Phoenix, how do you know it wasn't overlapped on purpose to give that pink an outline? can anyone produce a clear picture of a factory stripe that does NOT have the overlap to show it was a QC failure on the one pictured?

[phoenixgraphix]

Originally Posted by gto4evr

My thoughts exactly! Comparing those two pictures, that NOS stripe looks MUCH nicer than the reproduction stripe. The overlap defines the color change between the orange and pink stripe and makes the overall appearance much crisper.

Phoenix, how do you know it wasn't overlapped on purpose to give that pink an outline? can anyone produce a clear picture of a factory stripe that does NOT have the overlap to show it was a QC failure on the one pictured?

We know through years of research and having original pieces in stock. If you have knowledge that the overlap was intentionally done by a verifiable source from GM we will certainly look at your information.

['ol Pinion head]

Originally Posted by phoenixgraphix

We know through years of research and having original pieces in stock. If you have knowledge that the overlap was intentionally done by a verifiable source from GM we will certainly look at your information.

Is that how the Pontiac restoration hobby got the red "Buick" style aircleaner stickers?
I see your company offers them in some form of $109 "technical decal pkg"

[gto4evr]

Originally Posted by 'ol Pinion head

Is that how the Pontiac restoration hobby got the red "Buick" style aircleaner stickers?
I see your company offers them in some form of $109 "technical decal pkg"

Snap! Apparently years of research has also proven that the uninformed have wallets as well as those questing for correctness, no need to halt or correct disinformation when there are willing buyers ready to spend money on what they think they need……The customer is always right!

Can anyone else confirm about the 3M backing and the comment about factory 69 stripes having varying widths?

[gtohurstjudge]

The stripes in your pictures are nos stripes. I have several boxes of nos stripes
on my shelf and they have the same identical top peel off layer, same backing and same mismatch from panel to panel. The factory stripes are printed on white film, so that the yellow
stripe is not yellow on the edge, but white. As I said, people who know 69 Judge stripes
who have never seen DCS stripes from Year One flip out over them because they look so much better.As I said, I heard that you can't buy DCS stripes anymore but I have not confirmed that fact. To me the variation and width and the white edge on the stripe look terrible.

[phoenixgraphix]

Originally Posted by The Boss

So I should read that as "We will continue to produce the stripes in the manner we believe GM intended them." rather than "we will produce the stripes the way GM produced them"?

The answer to your question is the Phoenix Graphix Judge stripes are correctly produced stripes that are silk screened like OEM. Not all Judges as you have shown in your photo have the alleged pinstripe. The intended process was to have individual colors not overlaps in color which produced the "pinstripe" look due to poor silk screening.

Many of today's manufacturers of the Judges stripes are digitally printed and not restoration pieces licensed by GM. GM GTO Stripes were originally done as a silk screen with specific widths and the stripe comes it a definite point in each stripe, many reproductions are not only the incorrect widths the end of the stripes are not finished correctly. We provide restoration correct stripes It all comes down to how much you want to invest $$$ in your vehicle. Some people have show cars and others want drivers. As an individual you will have to make the choice.

[Bermuda Blue]

Originally Posted by phoenixgraphix

The stripe you are showing as a NOS stripe with a pinstripe is where the pink silk screened color is actually overlapping the orange. The colors are individual and should not overlap. We corrected this issue by making sure the colors did not overlap when they are silk screened. Thank you for your question.

Picture of original stripe . I do not see an overlap on this stripe which creates the separation mentioned earlier. would be interesting to get a larger sampling of original and NOS stripes and see if this separation (color overlap) can be tied to NOS stripes which may have been manufactured by a different supplier.

[Ram4king]

One note for the 69 chart. Antique gold,champagne and expression brown judges left the factory with the olive stripes.

[Jack Ferris]

Originally Posted by Ram4king

One note for the 69 chart. Antique gold,champagne and expression brown judges left the factory with the olive stripes.

Maybe the factories differed. Like my CR Judge, I have seen Espresso Brown Judges in the late 70's with their original colors and the White/Red/BLACK stripe combo. In fact we sold one last year that we did in our shop and I put those exact stripes on it.