[dhutton]

Originally Posted by 64speed

If I give my paint man the 6500 up front and 500 a month how often would you check on the car? He is 45 mins to an hour away so I was thinking I would drive down once a month and write a check in person and check on the car. I can also keep track of him on Facebook.

That doesn’t make a lot of sense to me. How long is the job supposed to take?

Don

[64speed]

Originally Posted by dhutton

That doesn’t make a lot of sense to me. How long is the job supposed to take?

Don

The estimate is between 13 and 15 grand

[64speed]

What is a person in my situation supposed to do? Barnes restorations which has a sterling reputation in this area wouldn’t even take it out of my driveway without a 10K deposit. There is another shop called Kings Kustoms around here but he won’t give you an estimate just bills by the hour. Classic Pontiac Rescue wants 6500 up front for materials and to begin labor and then take 500 a month after that until the job is complete. Estimate is between 13-15K. That is returned to me painted,assembled, glass in it, and ready to have drivetrain installed and go to upholstery shop. He is providing the glass.

[Cardo]

I'd be negotiating or find someone else. Maybe one of the painters here can explain why so much up front? I don't quite understand. All of the material doesn't need to be purchased immediately. I have seen way too many people get screwed to let that much go up front. I could understand 2 or 3 thousand, but half? I don't think so. The guy painting always has the option to stop working on the car and push it outside if you don't make the payment. Once i let go of that money, it's gone with not much recourse to get it back. If the painter let's you go to the point where he's out because you didn't pay, shame on him because he should know better too. Just trying to be fair to both parties here. It's like working with the Russians - Trust but verify.

[dhutton]

Originally Posted by 64speed

The estimate is between 13 and 15 grand

But how long? It seems like he is saying it will take at least a year. Red flag right there imho....

What is the hourly labor rate?

Don

[TAKerry]

Bottom line is that its expensive to have a car painted. Even more so to restore a car. In the long run it is much cheaper to buy one finished. If someone is going to put $5k-$6k down, then $400-$500 month for a paint job, then you may as well spread that payment out over another year or two and buy a complete car that you can enjoy now, not 5 or 6 years down the road. If I couldn't do the majority of the work myself I would not be in this hobby.

[TAKerry]

Originally Posted by MUSLCAH

By reading all these horror stories......all you experts ,should do your own body and paint....then no one gets screwed.

2017-11-09_12-05-10 by Kerry Grubb, on Flickr
Exactly what I did! I have less than $3k in tools and materials to apply the paint.

[MUSLCAH]

^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^ like noted above....looks good from here...And yes....go buy one all done. Much cheaper and your driving ,with a Big smile on your face. That’s what I did, and I do this for a living....lol

[AkCamaro]

I just spent $13,500 cash for labor plus $3200 credit card for paint and materials to get my 73 TA painted. It took around nine months. I delivered it disassembled and stripped of paint and I took it home disassembled and painted. My guy replaced the trunk pan, tail panel, drivers side front floor, and a bit work metal replacement to the lower front quarters and inners. He also did extensive body work to the fenders, doors, quarters, hood. He put a lot of hours into the nose and urethane/fiberglass components to save and use all the OEM stuff. I didn’t end up using any aftermarket flares or lower front valence because my guy was able to repair them all.
My body guy/painter is very particular, and I got back a car that’s pretty much perfect. So I’m pretty happy. It was supposed to take three months, but it ended up being a bigger job then we first expected, and my guy wasn’t willing to half ass anything.
I would guess that he has 250 hours into my car. I paid the shop as work was completed, about $1-2,000 a month. I bought materials as they were needed.
Now I just gotta remember how to put the car back together.

[Cardo]

^^^Excellent AK! Your car looks great, and that to me is the way this should go. Sounds like you got a great body guy for a price that was fair to both of you, and both were protected in the process. To me, this is exactly the way paint / body work should go. Love the color too!!

[64speed]

Ok so I called the body guy and told him I was getting feedback that half up front was not normal. He asked me what kind of deposit I wanted to put down and I said materials and 20 hours labor. He agreed. My car as you may know from my thread has had everything replaced already by AMD so I only need a few minor dents and the paint stripped. I told him I wanted to get this done as fast as possible and he suggested that rather than do a huge cash outlay or even a deposit that I could bring him the hood for example. Let him fix and prime it I pay for it then move on to the trunk lid etc until all the body work was done. Then my only big expense at once would be paint and reassembly. I think I am gonna take him the worse of the two hoods I have and let him fix it and if it passes muster then I am gonna do it that way. He has seen the car in person and he told me that if all the pieces were done and ready then paint and reassembly would not exceed 5500 dollars

[64speed]

By the way I will own classic cars all my life but I will never do another frame off. I will buy a nice car and do my touches.

[Dens71TA]

Classic Pontiac Rescue is Joe Jackson AKA Bonneville Joe. He's well known in the Pontiac community. I wouldn't have any worry dealing with him.

[Forrest]

Great thread..sorry to see this happen to anybody! .I have always only done one car at a time ( with a small overlap at times)..usually takes a year or less...I have other income from property rentals etc..which keeps my income stream pretty steady....I ask for a third up front.. a third half way finished ( usually when body back on frame all things ready for paint,and drive train completed and installed ) and final third payment when completed ( interior,painting, Top?, assembly, DONE!).. I also set up some kind of "joint account" for parts and supplies that is replenished as necessary by owner...this way he sees what exactly is being spent and what for...and since I ONLY farm out machine work on block it keeps my costs down and I don't have to depend on outsourcing completion time problems....always worked well for me and the customer..doing one at a time makes it more comfortable for me and the other guy.. knowing it will not be on any "back burner"..although I am slowing down somewhat..age ..pains..you know!?....good luck to all!

[MUSLCAH]

Originally Posted by AkCamaro

I just spent $13,500 cash for labor plus $3200 credit card for paint and materials to get my 73 TA painted. It took around nine months. I delivered it disassembled and stripped of paint and I took it home disassembled and painted. My guy replaced the trunk pan, tail panel, drivers side front floor, and a bit work metal replacement to the lower front quarters and inners. He also did extensive body work to the fenders, doors, quarters, hood. He put a lot of hours into the nose and urethane/fiberglass components to save and use all the OEM stuff. I didn’t end up using any aftermarket flares or lower front valence because my guy was able to repair them all.
My body guy/painter is very particular, and I got back a car that’s pretty much perfect. So I’m pretty happy. It was supposed to take three months, but it ended up being a bigger job then we first expected, and my guy wasn’t willing to half ass anything.
I would guess that he has 250 hours into my car. I paid the shop as work was completed, about $1-2,000 a month. I bought materials as they were needed.
Now I just gotta remember how to put the car back together.

Is the clear ...cut and buffed ??

[Heybuck]

AkCamaro,

Your car looks great in the pictures and yes, I like the colour.

BUT, tell me why the door strikers were left on and painted? That just looks half assed to me. First time the door locks on the striker - scratches and chips. Those strikers should be cad plated, removed for paint and replaced after paint.
What's so hard about that??

[Dens71TA]

Originally Posted by Heybuck

BUT, tell me why the door strikers were left on and painted?

That is how they were built at the factory. Door striker and latch mechanism and on early cars even the window regulator and tracks were installed before the body shell hit the ELPO primer bath tank. Everything should have body color on it for a correct restoration.

[Heybuck]

Originally Posted by Dens71TA

That is how they were built at the factory. Door striker and latch mechanism and on early cars even the window regulator and tracks were installed before the body shell hit the ELPO primer bath tank. Everything should have body color on it for a correct restoration.

OK, thanks for that. I'm always willing to learn and admit if I'm wrong.
Ian

[TAKerry]

Originally Posted by Heybuck

OK, thanks for that. I'm always willing to learn and admit if I'm wrong.
Ian

Factory correct to paint, but I agree with you, I think they look better unpainted, the paint is going to be chipped off anyway!

[AkCamaro]

Originally Posted by MUSLCAH

Is the clear ...cut and buffed ??

No. It was a little, actually, but they are going to go over the entire car after it’s assembled. Hopefully I’ll drive it over at the end of summer and they will cut and buff it, then I’ll put the decals on after obviously.