[Jay S]

Both BAM and Gaterman are ran by people that came from Crane. They are separate companies, but Gaterman to me is the hydrualic roller counterpart to BAM. If Gaterman lifters are in stock they are my first pick. They have pin oiling and a better plunger feeding features than all the other HR lifters. I wish they had floating axles like most SR lifters, but Morel is the only ones that have that feature. Morel doesn’t have enough control on the bleed rates for that cam. You are not the first person to have the staked axles slide around.

If the Gatermans aren’t available a Comp Evolutions are my second choice unless the springs are extra heavy.

[charlie66]

Originally Posted by Jay S

Both BAM and Gaterman are ran by people that came from Crane. They are separate companies, but Gaterman to me is the hydrualic roller counterpart to BAM. If Gaterman lifters are in stock they are my first pick. They have pin oiling and a better plunger feeding features than all the other HR lifters. I wish they had floating axles like most SR lifters, but Morel is the only ones that have that feature. Morel doesn’t have enough control on the bleed rates for that cam. You are not the first person to have the staked axles slide around.

If the Gatermans aren’t available a Comp Evolutions are my second choice unless the springs are extra heavy.

I went on Gatermans site and there's no pricing.

What about the Isky lifters. My machinist keeps letting me to get them. What's your thoughts on the Iskys?

[Jay S]

Even though the OF1 has a more lift than a 236/242 Bulter cam, the Bulter cam will make just as much sowing machine noise as the OF1. The OF1 has softer profiles on and off the valve seats. The more aggressive intensity of the Bulter cam is why it is not a good candidate to run with mechanical lifters on Aluminum heads. The OF1 works fine with mechanical lifters on Aluminum heads.

[charlie66]

Originally Posted by Jay S

Both BAM and Gaterman are ran by people that came from Crane. They are separate companies, but Gaterman to me is the hydrualic roller counterpart to BAM. If Gaterman lifters are in stock they are my first pick. They have pin oiling and a better plunger feeding features than all the other HR lifters. I wish they had floating axles like most SR lifters, but Morel is the only ones that have that feature. Morel doesn’t have enough control on the bleed rates for that cam. You are not the first person to have the staked axles slide around.

If the Gatermans aren’t available a Comp Evolutions are my second choice unless the springs are extra heavy.

I went on Gatermans site and there's no pricing.

What about the Isky lifters. My machinist keeps telling me to get them. What's your thoughts on the Iskys?

[Jay S]

I have not seen that Isky HPx are available with Pontiac link bars. I assume your machinist is talking about the HPx. It would be great if they were available for a Pontiac, all it would take is a different link bar. I think the HPx lifters are completely in a league of their own as far as advancements. They are 7500 RPM lifters that can run spring pressures and 525 lbs springs. They have a bushing option also. They are made by Johnson in Taylor Michigan.

Johnson PR’s are limited travel and would work about like the Evolutions but they are not pin oiled and don’t have the advancements in the plunger feeding like the HPx. Isky and Johnson worked together to come up with the HPx and are more advanced than a PR. The PR will handle more spring pressure than an Evolution.

[grivera]

Originally Posted by Jay S

The PR will handle more spring pressure than an Evolution.

What is the safe high limit for spring pressure with the CC Evolution HRs?

[Jay S]

Originally Posted by grivera

What is the safe high limit for spring pressure with the CC Evolution HRs?

It depends how aggressive the profile is. The body is rated for up to 500 lbs. But they won’t make it anywhere close to 500 lbs in a Pontiac and perform well. I’d say 150lbs seat an 400 open with .650ish lift is safe with the Bulter XR cam and evo’s. The OF1 could probably run about 165 lbs and 430 open with .650 ish lift and go a few hundred more RPMs than the more aggressive XR.

The Johnson PR’s (which are also reboxed as some Crowers and Isky’s) have a bigger diameter plunger and can handle aggressive cams, but the bodies are not as heavy as the evolutions and they do not have pin oiling.. The Isky HPx are rated for 535 lbs and 185 lbs seat at 7500 RPM. Some Morel short travels are up there also, but they are more of a race lifter an do not last well on the street.

[grivera]

Originally Posted by Jay S

It depends how aggressive the profile is. The body is rated for up to 500 lbs. But they won’t make it anywhere close to 500 lbs in a Pontiac and perform well. I’d say 150lbs seat an 400 open with .650ish lift is safe with the Bulter XR cam and evo’s. The OF1 could probably run about 165 lbs and 430 open with .650 ish lift and go a few hundred more RPMs than the more aggressive XR.

Good to hear. My KREs have PAC 1914 springs:
155lbs @ 1.835, 385 lbs @ 1.200

With the Harland Sharp 1.65 rockers, my lift is .627/.632

[charlie66]

Originally Posted by Jay S

I have not seen that Isky HPx are available with Pontiac link bars. I assume your machinist is talking about the HPx. It would be great if they were available for a Pontiac, all it would take is a different link bar. I think the HPx lifters are completely in a league of their own as far as advancements. They are 7500 RPM lifters that can run spring pressures and 525 lbs springs. They have a bushing option also. They are made by Johnson in Taylor Michigan.

Johnson PR’s are limited travel and would work about like the Evolutions but they are not pin oiled and don’t have the advancements in the plunger feeding like the HPx. Isky and Johnson worked together to come up with the HPx and are more advanced than a PR. The PR will handle more spring pressure than an Evolution.

Isky gave me this part number but its not coming up 9077hyrt.

I'm so confused on what to do it's not even funny lol

[Jay S]

Originally Posted by charlie66

Isky gave me this part number but its not coming up 9077hyrt.

I'm so confused on what to do it's not even funny lol

HAH! Well I will try a little better to not be confusing. Just go ahead and order those Isky’s.

The top 2 selling lifters are Evolutions from Compcams, and the Johnson 21160PR (which also go by Isky 9077hyrt and Crower has a part number also) Isky’s online catelog is hard very to sort thru, they never seem to have all their inventory listed. You have to call them to order something. It has always been like that. Gaterman’s the same way, you have to call them.

I have suggested Johnson lifters before, I am not afraid of them. I wish Isky would sell the HPx for a Pontiac. Quite a few guys choose Johnson over the Comps because the comps have more offshore parts in them, not everyone loves Compcams. I have Johnson mechanical rollers in one engine.

I actually have Hylift Johnson hydrualic rollers on the shelf, which is also an American made lifter.I have not mentioned them because I feel plunger valving is superior on the Johnson PR (or Isky 9077) for the cam you have.

[charlie66]

Originally Posted by Jay S

HAH! Well I will try a little better to not be confusing. Just go ahead and order those Isky’s.

The top 2 selling lifters are Evolutions from Compcams, and the Johnson 21160PR (which also go by Isky 9077hyrt and Crower has a part number also) Isky’s online catelog is hard very to sort thru, they never seem to have all their inventory listed. You have to call them to order something. It has always been like that. Gaterman’s the same way, you have to call them.

I have suggested Johnson lifters before, I am not afraid of them. I wish Isky would sell the HPx for a Pontiac. Quite a few guys choose Johnson over the Comps because the comps have more offshore parts in them, not everyone loves Compcams. I have Johnson mechanical rollers in one engine.

I actually have Hylift Johnson hydrualic rollers on the shelf, which is also an American made lifter.I have not mentioned them because I feel plunger valving is superior on the Johnson PR (or Isky 9077) for the cam you have.

Do you like the Evolutions over the johnson 21160pr? I see they have another one that has shorter travel. ST21160PR. .030 total travel? Whats your thoughts on that one?

heres a link

https://vincentperformance.com/parts...fters/pontiac/

[Jay S]

Originally Posted by charlie66

Do you like the Evolutions over the johnson 21160pr? I see they have another one that has shorter travel. ST21160PR. .030 total travel? Whats your thoughts on that one?

heres a link

https://vincentperformance.com/parts...fters/pontiac/

Short travels generally don’t last half as long as a limited travel lifter. I’d only use short travels for an engine that is mostly race on a modern platform that it isn’t practical to use a mechanical roller. I skip over short travels and go right to mechanicals on older platforms.

For this cam I think the Evolutions are a better designed lifter than the limited travel Johnson 21160PR and also have a better oil band location with pin oiling. Johnson hasn’t offered a lifter with pin oiling for a Pontiac yet. I would expect they could offer pin oiling eventually, they offer pin oiling for other platforms. The evolutions would be my choice over the Johnson PR for your application.

The Johnson’s are not a bad choice though and are a good alternative for those that do not want something from Comp. Some high points for Johnson are (like AG said) they are completely USA made and generally better quality control. Plus you can call right to the company and talk to someone that is an expert about lifters that is higher up than entery level sales. I would switch to the Johnson on an application if the valve springs requirements needed a lifter that can handle higher valve spring pressures or spring rates over 400 lbs/in.

[Jay S]

Originally Posted by charlie66

Do you like the Evolutions over the johnson 21160pr? I see they have another one that has shorter travel. ST21160PR. .030 total travel? Whats your thoughts on that one?

heres a link

https://vincentperformance.com/parts...fters/pontiac/

I should have looked at those part numbers closer. Those are pin oiled. I”ll look into those closer.