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#1
06-06-2004, 05:55 PM
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No debates here. My support is going to Bob & Frank at AllPontiacs. I havn't seen anyone else's operation, but I've seen Bob's, and I know that he won't put his name on anything if the quality isn't there.
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Just a blind squirrel looking for a nut. |
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#2
06-06-2004, 06:58 PM
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<BLOCKQUOTE class="ip-ubbcode-quote"><font size="-1">quote:</font><HR>Originally posted by slowbird:
Still need some high flowing race heads that will feed 540+cid. <HR></BLOCKQUOTE> I agree. |
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#3
06-04-2004, 08:34 AM
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<BLOCKQUOTE class="ip-ubbcode-quote"><font size="-1">quote:</font><HR>Originally posted by Ron:
Paul will this block be available without the cooling holes? <HR></BLOCKQUOTE> THAT WOULD BE WAY COOL!!!!
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77 Trans Am All Steel, on 10" tires 8.30 @ 165 mph 3,380 LBS Mat it! Spray it! Chute it! Just another 8 Second Pass! |
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#4
06-06-2004, 07:04 AM
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Turns out the Genesis people are a sub company of the name I heard from Banks.
Tom V.
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"Engineers do stuff for reasons" Tom Vaught Despite small distractions, there are those who will go Forward, Learning, Sharing Knowledge, Doing what they can to help others move forward. |
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#5
06-06-2004, 08:28 PM
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Well, I'm just telling you what Grumpy told me while chewing the butt of a cigar at the 76 US Nationals...
 
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#6
06-07-2004, 09:56 AM
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Technology is amazing. I'll just listen and learn. My father always believed in doing things as best as you can.Thanks you guys for doing things correctly. Another Italian here.
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#7
06-04-2004, 06:48 AM
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prototype block #1 pictured. first step was to fit crank, check all tapped holes, deburr, dry fit etc. I smoothed out and enlarged all oil returns. When spraying wd40, certain areas of the block will retain oil, and of course getting the oil back to the sump is important.
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~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~ www.spottsperformance.com East Coast Pontiac engine builder - still going strong 4 month waiting list email [email protected] 1981 Trans Am 455 w/6X heads 4 speed 4 wheel disc (for sale) 1969 Trans Am clone 9.79 at 139 so far 1964 Banshee clone project - Opel GT platform |
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#8
06-05-2004, 07:23 AM
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<BLOCKQUOTE class="ip-ubbcode-quote"><font size="-1">quote:</font><HR>Originally posted by Brian Baker:
There is no "new" Butler iron block that I'm aware of, but I believe Butler still has a stash of IA-I blocks. <HR></BLOCKQUOTE> Brian: I've spoken with Jim on several occasions concerning their new aluminum AND iron blocks. Three iron blocks HAVE been cast, but they want to finish R&D and testing on the aluminum block before releasing the iron blocks for sale. My engine builder believes that an iron block is better suited for my purposes. I hate to step on any toes, but Jim has told me that the alloy in their iron block is FAR superior to the IA2 alloy and that each Butler iron block will be subjected to a "seasoning" process prior to shipping.
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Regards, "455HO" Lloyd 2008 GMC Sierra Denali 2WD Crew, L92 6L80E, Silver w/ Ebony guts, 14.26 @ 98 
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#9
06-07-2004, 09:14 AM
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Oh - Jim also mentioned that it's a marketing deal to release the iron block sometime after the aluminum block. Gotta recoup some of their development costs on the alloy deal before releasing the less expensive iron piece!
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Regards, "455HO" Lloyd 2008 GMC Sierra Denali 2WD Crew, L92 6L80E, Silver w/ Ebony guts, 14.26 @ 98
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#10
06-04-2004, 10:24 PM
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I knew Butler was woking on the Aluminum block, but was unaware of a new iron effort. What is the difference between the IA2 and Butler Iron?
Paul, That looks sweet. I want one.
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You know it's going to be a good day when you wake up breathing! |
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#11
06-05-2004, 05:44 AM
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Ron,
The answer is yes, I asked that question in the VMP Pictures post. http://forums.performanceyears.com/g...=399104926&p=2
__________________
Wade Congdon BOP Engineering Hi-Performance Specialty Parts for Buick, Olds, and Pontiac www.bopengineering.com |
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#12
06-05-2004, 03:57 PM
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Thanks Bob for the extra info.
Looking forward to seeing your block at Norwalk. The threaded water jacket plugs I hope are aluminum with an "o" ring on the plug that seals against a machined surface? Tom V.
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"Engineers do stuff for reasons" Tom Vaught Despite small distractions, there are those who will go Forward, Learning, Sharing Knowledge, Doing what they can to help others move forward. |
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#13
06-05-2004, 06:32 PM
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<BLOCKQUOTE class="ip-ubbcode-quote"><font size="-1">quote:</font><HR>Originally posted by Lloyd-TX:
<BLOCKQUOTE class="ip-ubbcode-quote"><font size="-1">quote:</font><HR>Originally posted by Brian Baker: There is no "new" Butler iron block that I'm aware of, but I believe Butler still has a stash of IA-I blocks. <HR></BLOCKQUOTE> Brian: I've spoken with Jim on several occasions concerning their new aluminum AND iron blocks. Three iron blocks HAVE been cast, but they want to finish R&D and testing on the aluminum block before releasing the iron blocks for sale. My engine builder believes that an iron block is better suited for my purposes. I hate to step on any toes, but Jim has told me that the alloy in their iron block is FAR superior to the IA2 alloy and that each Butler iron block will be subjected to a "seasoning" process prior to shipping. <HR></BLOCKQUOTE> Is that so? Haven't heard Butler advertising about any new iron block coming out, just the aluminum. Seems awful peculiar that the only block in town was the Indian Adventures block, before Bob & Frank purchased the rights to that block from Dick. Now there are suddenly other new blocks coming out of the woodwork (with the KRE block I saw at VMP looking like a dead ringer for the IA-II block). Stepping on toes indeed. 
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Just a blind squirrel looking for a nut. |
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#14
06-05-2004, 03:58 PM
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Just when you think it can't get any better; registered mains and threaded freeze plugs!
5 megawatt tranducer? Those blocks singing when you check them? -Rob |
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#15
06-05-2004, 07:38 PM
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Paul,
Block and pictures are impressive. Appears to me the deck is nearly dry. Finish machine work looks super. I will have to send these pictures to the son-in-law of the PMD's original V8 designer. HIS
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95 Towncar that needs more TQ. Sold 2023: 12.24/111.6MPH/1.76 60'/28"/3.54:1/SP-TH400/469 R96A/236-244-112LC/1050&TorkerI//3850Lbs//15MPG/89oct Sold 2003: 12.00/112MPH/1.61 60'/26"x3.31:1/10"/469 #48/245-255-110LSA/Q-Jet-Torker/3650Lbs//18MPG 94oct Sold 1994: 11.00/123MPH/1.50 60'/29.5"x4.10:1/10"/469 #48/245-255-110LSA/Dual600s-Wenzler/3250Lbs//94oct |
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#16
06-06-2004, 03:36 PM
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Still need some high flowing race heads that will feed 540+cid.
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#17
06-07-2004, 08:49 AM
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76? David, how old were you in 76?
 I didn't think you had that many more miles than me and I was 7!
__________________
A Government big enough to give you everything you want is strong enough to take everything you have. - Jefferson  "If ever a time should come, when vain and aspiring men shall possess the highest seats in Government, our country will stand in need of its experienced patriots to prevent its ruin." - Samuel Adams Right and wrong doesn't need facts all the time. -Lighthouseman ("lawyer") Starnes Performance Automatics www.Starnesperformance.com |
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#18
06-07-2004, 04:15 PM
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It's not the product or its differences at issue, it's how the product was obtained/derived. I don't think I've thrown any stones. That's my point and I'm sticking to it.
__________________
Just a blind squirrel looking for a nut. |
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#19
06-05-2004, 08:49 AM
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Would be something for the Butler's to produce a Cast Iron Pontiac block too! On the alloy statement, what is FAR SUPERIOR to excellent? I'm going to offer Cryogenic option for seasoning on the blocks I sell but I doubt anyone will find any material bonus from KRE, JPB, or All Pontiac.
I can say that IA/Dick Duclowe years were strong usuable blocks, IAII is well revised very, very good looking and will most likely be the first one available to the public. KRE's casting looks great, but machining hasn't been done. Haven't seen JBP's alum block in person but the pictures that were posted of the casting last year look really good and dynoing to 2900hp is a obvious sign. Don't know about the JBP plan for date of release to sell cast iron or aluminum. -Rob |
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#20
06-05-2004, 11:34 AM
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Tom,
This is a quote from TA Bob "All of the water cross overs will be blocked on the out board side of the head surface. The builders will transfer the holes that best meet the holes in the head being used." I guess I took that as they would be cast, shut. I also had a conversation with Rob that if they were 5/16 that they could be opened further or plugged easily. So now I'm not sure.  What I can tell you is that mine were a PITA to plug as some were overlapping and required a very large hole to cover completely. I spent a weekend with a magnetic drill, a large selection of resharped end mills to find tap drill sizes, and pipe plugs 
__________________
Wade Congdon BOP Engineering Hi-Performance Specialty Parts for Buick, Olds, and Pontiac www.bopengineering.com |
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