[Brian Baker]

When installing the remote setup, did you eliminate the factory filter housing? If so, you cannot conclusively say the problem was with the filter(s).

[GTO]

I did eliminate the housing but there is nothing in it! The passages are all open and you can clearly see this. When the first filter went bad I replaced it with an HP2 on that housing. This brought my pressure back and everything was OK. I went for a ride and when I came back I changed the oil and installed another HP2. When I fired the motor I had no pressure whatsoever! I shut her down and did a visual check and found nothing so I thought that maybe it took a while to come up to pressure because you can't get 2 bad filters in a row right? Well I fired the motor and still nothing. Changed gage, still nothing. Had I found my remote setup I would have solved it last night! Brian I am POSITIVE that the filters are at fault! I will be sending them to Fram for inspection and hopefully they will be honest! I want nothing from them! I might just cut them open myself to see what the problem was. Hey, come up for a beer and some Black Bear wrestling and you can help me inspect them! ... Eric

[Brian Baker]

Black Bear wrestling? I'll pass. Canadian beer sounds good though (I always did like Molson). Maybe at Norwhack?

[60man]

Worked as sales rep for NAPA for ten years I will use nothing but NAPA Gold or Wix filters. They back their filter with engine replacement if their filter was the culprit.I have cut open many different brands of filters. Most are tin cans with cardboard glued to about 1/2 the filter media of a Wix and incorperates a piece of bent tin for by pass spring. Having said this I will say I have not cut open a HP series Fram. Might prove interesting. I know the consumer grade Fram is nothing I would consider using on my John Deere much less my race car.

Outlaw Pontiac Racers Association"For Those Who Live The Legend"

Do it now fool! Life is short.

[dragula81]

60Man is exactly right. I worked for a NAPA at one time and we made a counter display by cutting open about 5 different brands of oil filters including Fram. I personally bought and cut open each of these fitlers myself (got the Fram at Wal-mart) for the display so there was no "trickery" involved.
The NAPA Gold (made by Wix) had metal end caps glued to a fiber heavily pleated element and a heavy duty spring loaded bypas valve on the end.
The Fram had cardboard end caps glued to a paper filter with literally a string tied around the pleated element to keep it from "popping open" and the bypass valve was just a bent piece of flat metal...no spring at all.
The NAPA and one of the other filters were very similar. I think it was the Motorcraft filter (which may be made by WIX also), I don't remember.
The poor quality of the cheap Fram was so obvious that any idiot could see it. We would still have "Fram people" come in and look at our display and still argue that they would never stop using Fram's. Some people are hardheaded.
Drag

http://webpages.charter.net/dragula7

[rasilverbird]

<BLOCKQUOTE class="ip-ubbcode-quote"><font size="-1">quote:</font><HR>Originally posted by Mr_GTO:
Fram's are junk.<HR></BLOCKQUOTE>Word. I'll never use another Fram product. AC Delco for me.

1996 WS6
1968 GTO

[khkiley1]

I think this
link was posted once before but it is extremely informative. This guy took the time to cut open a bunch of filters and compare them on his site.

Worth a look.

Kurt

The IQ and life expectancy of the average American just passed each other going in opposite directions.

[Tim Corcoran]

Anyone who has over a hundred bucks in his motor should read the oil filter study. The Frame filter is a piece of you know what. If you've been lucky so far that's great but your living on borrowed time.

Tim C

65 LeMans, 3500lb. D-ports and a flat tappet cam, 10.92@120

[Fox]

Yep I use nothing but AC Delco filters in mine.

[mikeb]

I used my last fram several years ago. There are lots of stories of fram filter failures on the various messageboards I read. I actually cringe whenever I see a race car sporting a fram filter.

I usually pick up a purolator or A/C for my T/A and motorcraft for my brand X vehicles

[sscherin]

Anyone cut open a Napa silver filter?

the PN's match the Napa gold and wix lines.
going by a quick visual check they look the same.

GURU: One who knows more jargon than you

Scott Schering
70 Firebird 455 12.34 @ 108.2
Http://www.pontiacs.org

[Steve C.]

The Fram HP series compettion oil filters are a very different animal than a regular store bought Fram filter. Besides being larger, the case and insides are different.

I have been using a Fram HP-2 for years. Also the NAPA (WIX) #1049 is a larger size filter that is very similar in size to the Fram HP-2.

[Brian Baker]

Ditto to what Steve said. Sheesh! I've been going to the same diner for breakfast every Friday for 5 years, and the food is great, but because one person tells me they went there and got sick from eating the food, I should stop going?

Of these Fram failures, has anyone documented that it was an HP series filter that failed? No? I'll keep using the HP1 with confidence, thank you. Been using the HP1 for 5 years now without fail.

[basketcase70gto]

What 60Man said is exactly right. I worked at a local carquest for 5 years. Our filter rep showed up one day with a filter cutter so we decided to check things out. We took both a Carquest blue and red filters off the shelf and cut them open along with a ac delco, fram,and a quaker state. The Carquest filters are also made by wix and the blue\red is the same as the napa gold\silver lines. The only filter that was more scary inside that the fram was the quaker state. That filter had the little string tied around the element to keep it from blowing apart( maybe that makes it better than the fram?) Cardboard end caps and a stamped piece of tin for a bypass spring is not what I would consider a quality filter. A dirt track buddy of mine would not listen to me because his high-buck engine builder recommends the fram. He learned the hard way when the filter element came loose inside the can and blocked all the oil flow through the filter. The bypass on the filter adapter was plugged so it roasted the motor! Fram filters- great marketing, crappy filter

[Brian Baker]

Regarding these "strings" around the outside of the filter element, I think the issue with them being there is getting blown out of proportion. The oil enters the filter on the outside of the element and exits through the center. If anything, the element media would collapse in a failure, not "blow out". The "string" is probably there to hold the element in place (or in shape) while the end caps are being placed on it in manufacturing.

[dragula81]

Hey Brian,
I assume the string is actually on there to keep them from "blowing out" like an umbrella during the manufacturing process. When they are being "stuffed" into the cans. Maybe I didn't use the correct wording.
Thanks,
Drag

http://webpages.charter.net/dragula7

[Tim Corcoran]

sscherin

The Napa Silver and Gold oil filters are both excellent oil filters as pointed out in the oil filter study. The part numbers are different between the silver and gold filters. They both contain the same suffix but the prefix is definitely different. The reason the suffix is the same is to make it easier when matching up applications, and the different the prefix is to differentiate between the gold and the silver. I have inspected both the gold and the silver filters with the metal casing removed. At first glance they look exactly the same, but after closer examination you will notice more filter media surface area on the gold than the silver. Basically the only difference between the two is the gold has more pleats than the silver.

Tim C

65 LeMans, 3500lb. D-ports and a flat tappet cam, 10.92@120

[grnmnstr]

I have been using Fram HP-2 filters on my 10 sec 455s for 9 years. Never had a problem.

73 Firebird 455 D-Port, 3250 lbs.
Best ET: 9.93 @ 133 mph with a 1.318 60'

[TTS]

Basketcase I had the same thing happen in 84' to a Dodge van, 318 engine. A couple of days after oil change the engine seized. The Dodge dealership found the Fram oil filter had disassembled. Fram bought the engine, so I have less problems with the company, I won't buy a filter from them though.

[stu]

Ok I'll never buy another Fram, I get AC or Fram dependng on what's in stock and never had a Fram issue but what's the harm in AC.