[lust4speed]

So if the kid had released the emergency brake on his dad's truck and rolled down hill through a group of kids crossing the street - would you not own a truck? Or would you blame the father for being totally incompetent in allowing his young son the opportunity to cause mayhem. Somehow when a firearm is involved, it becomes the fault of that inanimate object instead of placing the blame where it belongs. You wouldn't blame the truck - don't blame the firearm.

As screwy as California laws are at least they don't blame the gun - the father would have mandatory jail time if a minor discharges a weapon and causes harm. I'm sure the father did not had a CCW or even decent firearms training. The situation proves the guy was an idiot with no common sense to leave a weapon in the truck.

[71 T/A]

Originally Posted by Elarson

The owner of a loaded gun should either have it fully under direct control (on his person) or have it locked up. Leaving it someplace "handy" like in a car (or a women's purse, etc.) opens up this possibility.

IMHO,
Eric

That really is my point. I don't feel I need a gun, but if I had one, I would keep it on me or in a good hidden spot under lock and key.

In the case where the father leaves the gun in his truck, he is totally to blame. What if he was getting his truck's oil changed, someone steals the gun and commits a crime. It's the same deal. Irresponsible people like that shouldn't have guns.

[Jim Scites]

Originally Posted by Elarson

The owner of a loaded gun should either have it fully under direct control (on his person) or have it locked up. Leaving it someplace "handy" like in a car (or a women's purse, etc.) opens up this possibility.

IMHO,
Eric

Let's see, I have a gun in my house and it's locked up where the children can't get to it, someone breaks into the house and starts to harm my children, or my wife... Do I call the police and tell them to hurry, my daughter is getting beaten? or tell them to "Hold on a minute while I find the keys to unlock the safe to get my gun."? Or do I reach into the night stand and end all this right now? I choose #3. Keeping a gun locked up and unloaded is like having an antique car that you can't buy gas for or be able to drive.
ANY child getting hurt or killed is a terrible tragedy, but more children get hurt or killed on bicycles or skateboards that with guns and we don't hear anyone calling for banning bikes or skateboards.

[tempest455]

It took me some time to make my wife understand that every time I take my kids to the gun range, the drive there and back is far more dangerous than the range itself.

[Elarson]

Originally Posted by Jim Scites

Let's see, I have a gun in my house and it's locked up where the children can't get to it, someone breaks into the house and starts to harm my children, or my wife... Do I call the police and tell them to hurry, my daughter is getting beaten? or tell them to "Hold on a minute while I find the keys to unlock the safe to get my gun."? Or do I reach into the night stand and end all this right now? I choose #3. Keeping a gun locked up and unloaded is like having an antique car that you can't buy gas for or be able to drive.
ANY child getting hurt or killed is a terrible tragedy, but more children get hurt or killed on bicycles or skateboards that with guns and we don't hear anyone calling for banning bikes or skateboards.

Let's see....when you get up and leave the bedroom in the morning, do you leave the gun loaded and unattended? Or do you control it somehow?

Just curious,
Eric

[Jim Scites]

My children are 17 and 22 and I don't have to worry about them, they have their own guns. I do agree that children need to be protected around guns, that's a given. But to say that all guns need to be locked away and unloaded is rediculous. Guns without ammunition are just like big rocks, not much use in self defense. If you choose not to have guns in your house that's fine but don't ridicule others that choose to protect themselves and their families. The battle cry of the liberals has always been "If it only saves one child" and I, personally am getting tired of hearing that crap.

[Elarson]

I'll assume that you're addressing somebody elses's approach because "all guns need to be locked away..." isn't what I said. And I'm very un-liberal.

I am 100% solely responsible for my guns....period.

If I am in the bedroom with my gun, it is loaded, unlocked and ready to go.
If I am out walking the farm and my gun is with me, it is loaded and ready to go.
If my gun is in the bedroom and I am not in there with it, it is unloaded.

Going back to the Ft. Lauderdale example, the gun owner was apparently not in the vehicle; so leaving the loaded gun in there offered absolutely no benefit in regards to protecting the family.

Hope this clears up any misconception,
Eric

[Jim Scites]

I agree, when I am going out or on a trip, I have a loaded gun with me in my truck. When I leave the truck I take the gun with me. I forgot and left my gun in the truck the other night, (the truck was locked of course) but before I went to bed I went out and got it, brought it in the house with me and stored it away. leaving a loaded gun in your truck all the time, even when you are not in the truck is a very bad thing. I'm sorry if I misrepresented you, I don't know you and I shouldn't assume. My guns are always locked in a safe except for a select few and they are locked in a finger groove safe for easy access. I do feel a need, now more than ever to protect myself and my family.

[Elarson]

I'm glad we got that cleared up. BTW: you didn't mention your finger groove safe....that sounds like good control to me.

FYI: Smith & Wesson M&P 9mm and Kahr PM9. Also, I don't have to leave my gun(s) loaded when I leave the house....my wife has her own M&P that she is 100% solely responsible for.

Eric

[Cliff R]

Keep in mind that arming yourself doesn't make up for a lack of SITUATIONAL AWARENESS. You must also keep the gun on your person or very close at hand, or most likely you will not be able to bring it into use when a situation to use it arises.

A few years ago, I went out late at night to fuel up my truck, and grab some milk at a local 7-11. It was pretty late, and as I fueled up my truck I noticed a dirt-bag hanging out on the side of the store. He looked in my direction several times and always turned away if I looked in his direction. At one point he urinated on the side of the building. I took some extra time at the pump, hoping he would leave, washed the windshield, checked the fluids, etc. He stayed and kept glancing in my direction.

I knew at this point there was a high probability I was being targeted, so I took my pistol from the holster and put it in my front coat pocket, making it much easier to bring into play if/as needed. I headed toward the store to get the milk and pay the bill and sure enough he headed toward me in an intercept course. About half way to the store he blocked my way and demanded money.

He never produced a weapon, and didn't repeat his demands when I told him that I was a Law Enforcment Officer. Instead, he quickly changed tune (I call this sort of dialog "chuck-in and jive-in") and asked for a ride to the VFW. I declined, and suggested that he get the fluck out of my way and vacate the premises immediately, which he did. I would imagine he spent the next 20 minutes cleaning out his shorts.

He knew by my reaction to his presence, and verbal dialog, that I was not a sheep, and was fully prepared to do battle. It would have been a shame to blow a hole in that jacket, it was my favorite one, but that's what he would have got if he had done anything other that what he was told to do. During the entire event my hand was on my revolver and it was pointed at his chest......FWIW.....Cliff

[Region Warrior]

I can fire my semi auto's while still holstered in inside my coats.
Just got to make sure dont get smacked in the chest from the recoil.

[Cobrabill]

Originally Posted by Elarson

I'll assume that you're addressing somebody elses's approach because "all guns need to be locked away..." isn't what I said. And I'm very un-liberal.

I am 100% solely responsible for my guns....period.

If I am in the bedroom with my gun, it is loaded, unlocked and ready to go.
If I am out walking the farm and my gun is with me, it is loaded and ready to go.
If my gun is in the bedroom and I am not in there with it, it is unloaded.

Going back to the Ft. Lauderdale example, the gun owner was apparently not in the vehicle; so leaving the loaded gun in there offered absolutely no benefit in regards to protecting the family.

Hope this clears up any misconception,
Eric

There is a revolver hanging on the coat rack.A 20 guage over the arch going into the kitchen.Carbine next to the bed(wife's side).Riot gun in the chest at the foot of the bed..45 under my night stand..357 under my wifes night stand.Supressed .22 on the back of the couch.ALL LOADED.

All the guns in my house growing up were loaded.I've never touched them.Because if i did, after my father got done with me-ida wish i got shot.

An un-loaded gun is a stupid idea-like a car with no wheels.

[hurryinhoosier62]

Same here,Bill! My dad would have remove the skin off of my ass if I'd EVER touched
one of his firearms WITHOUT his permission. His view was simple.."An unloaded firearm
is dangerous!" Right now, there's a 12 gauge coach gun on my side of the bed and a
M48A Mauser just inside the closet door.

[aldbeir]

oops gun safety instructor shoots student in foot.this was at a concealed carry class held at a church.

[sleepy]

Originally Posted by aldbeir

oops gun safety instructor shoots student in foot.this was at a concealed carry class held at a church.

OOPS. NO LINK. Must be more complicated to use than a revolver

[Cobrabill]

Originally Posted by sleepy

OOPS. NO LINK. Must be more complicated to use than a revolver

[Stuckinda60s]

Reminds me of the DEA officer who shot himself in the foot while speaking to a middle school class.

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=_91jcFTbLE8

He's now suing the DEA because the tape got out and he is no longer able to teach classes, nor go undercover.

[hurryinhoosier62]

aldbeir,
Credible evidence is required. Most churches I've been to take a very dim view on concealed carry,especially in church. My current church is a noteable exception!!
At least 1 elder and 2 deacons carry in church.

[sixgunsblazing]

Originally Posted by hurryinhoosier62

aldbeir,
Credible evidence is required. Most churches I've been to take a very dim view on concealed carry,especially in church. My current church is a noteable exception!!
At least 1 elder and 2 deacons carry in church.

I began carrying in church about three years ago.

My gun goes with me always.

[Stuckinda60s]

Originally Posted by hurryinhoosier62

aldbeir,
Credible evidence is required. Most churches I've been to take a very dim view on concealed carry,especially in church. My current church is a noteable exception!!
At least 1 elder and 2 deacons carry in church.

Mine, too! As has been stated from the pulpit. And, he was referring to the congregation.