[PunchT37]

Originally Posted by shaker455

Wade,
I see the arms but he'll have to tell us if he's got 50cc pumps and I commonly use the 30cc pump arm on 50cc pumps to assure aircleaner clearance.

Roger that.

[joes455]

I run a quick fuel 830 with stock 1 3/4 bf, jets are 74 .070 pvcr / 87 sec. My suggestion is to check the float level and the transition circuts.. Idle circut has more influence on overall fuel ratio than one would think.Intake manifold temp also has a major roll.High temps from the fan blowing on the front bowl can literally dry out the primary pump shot.Best suggestion is join the Innovatives LM-1 site.

[Tom Vaught]

So you chit is still running good Darby after we made the changes?

Tom Vaught

[grandville455]

Originally Posted by Tom Vaught

So you chit is still running good Darby after we made the changes?

Tom Vaught

Absolutely Tom!.. Very excited to see what it does with its new rear!

[quicksilver97ta]

Thanks again for the replies. I had a chance to drive it instead of just throttling in the driveway. I bumped up my initial to about 19* as suggested (I have not forgot about adjusting my total back down) and drove the car a few miles. I pulled a few plugs to inspect and they don’t look lean from what I know.

• I pulled the carb again and verified the 172 throttle blades so it's truely an 830 cfm carb.

• Negative on the brown cams and 50 cc pumps. I don’t know what color to call them so here is a pic. They have 218 cast into them. These are 30 cc pumps. The borrowed tuning kit does have a set of 218's also but they are a natural plastic off white kind of color.

• There are also the 50 cc brown cams available in the tuning kit and I have a new 50 cc acc pump that came with the rebuild kit but the housing I do not have.

• Regarding the front only- I then install some 84 jets in just because it seemed cold natured and it liked the 80 to 82 change previously along with the 31 to 37 squirter change. While it just seemed cold natured the plugs tell a different story though, if they are an accurate sign. I only fired it up to check for leaks and then had to quit but brief throttling while cold showed no change so I think I went the wrong direction?

• Suggestions?

[quicksilver97ta]

Originally Posted by shaker455

Wade,
I see the arms but he'll have to tell us if he's got 50cc pumps and I commonly use the 30cc pump arm on 50cc pumps to assure aircleaner clearance.

How do you do that, does that larger 50 cc diaphram fit inside the 30 cc body? How would you adjust the arm? Right now its adjust per spec. Also, I guess you still have to use the 30 cc cams?

BTW I did put the 31 back in the rear as suggested.

Float is verified.

Immediate pump action f & r is verified.

Did not verify if the front shot lasts long enough, not brave enough to get that close.

[grandville455]

Hard to tell in pic, but looks orange? They both that color? U don't need the car running to see how long shot lasts either. So Your initial is 19 what is the total now? What is it still doing? Did u set the front and rear blades for transition holes properly?

[JoePapa]

Typically, when you snap the throttle and have a bog, it usually means your squirters aren’t big enough and/or your accelerator cam is incorrect. It could also be that your pump isn’t all the way open when you’re at WOT and therefore not squirting as much as possible.

When I put my 830 on my 400 I had some work to do. The high speed air bleeds were too big so I had to go smaller. I was at 90+ on the rear and going lean at WOT. Going to a smaller HSAB forced it to suck more fuel. I also changed out the idle air bleeds and the Idle Feed Restrictor screws to get the throttle response back. However, I had an LM-1 wide band to help me tune so I had a better picture than just a plug. Don’t get me wrong, plugs are good but limited in what they show you.

I had to really advance my distributor too. Turns out my cam wasn’t straight up so I had to advance my distributor to get the idle right. I took the carb off and set the butterflies to expose just a slight amount of the transfer slot – should look like a square. Then I used my distributor to adjust idle speed which really sounds weird. However, it worked. I then had to go back and limit total timing so make sure you check that.

So my changes were:

• Smaller high speed air bleeds
• Bigger idle air bleeds
• Smaller idle feed restrictor screws
• Advance the cam
• 2.5 power valve

My cam specs are in my sig.


+1 for the Innovate motorsports web page. They do a lot of carb tuning with the wide band – good info.

[quicksilver97ta]

Originally Posted by grandville455

Hard to tell in pic, but looks orange? They both that color? U don't need the car running to see how long shot lasts either. So Your initial is 19 what is the total now? What is it still doing? Did u set the front and rear blades for transition holes properly?

Doesn't look orange in person, more like a semi translucent dark tan? Total is now about 36* but I can adjust that later when I pull the distributor. Yeah I thought about checking the front squirter while not running after I posted and really should have took the opportunity while I had the carb off. I'll plan on it next time I make a jet change as I find it way better to pull the carb off even if just for that.
Cams are the same front and rear. I don't think I have transition holes in the rear, no 4 corner idle.

[grandville455]

dark tan they are probably the white ones then. I would get the pink ones atleast. also u still need the back secondary blades set to where u adjust them to where they are closed than open about a half turn or so from that seated positon, transtion in front should be square. You do have your pump arms adjusted at WOT So they are not bottoming out the pump? If it won't idle drill some small holes in only primary blades to begin with.I would put a 50 pump on front too with a 37 and leave the back at 31 and 30 c.c pump

[shaker455]

Quick,

Dist:
If you have your initinal @ 19 then leave the vac advance unplugged for now.

You posted you have 18 degrees of mech adv so that is good if your at about 37 total.

Start up and shut off okay?

What RPM does it all your advance come in by?

Okay the Carb:

You have an 830...okay

You need a 50cc spring & housing to run a 50cc pump set up so you don't have enough parts.

You have a #218 cam and I have one here too....it appears almost white or slightly green.

If you have the Pink #330 cam try them as they will produce the most cc's per shot.

Green is the next one down from the pink.

Your plug looks slightly lean but you need to go out and put some miles on them to color up.

[quicksilver97ta]

Originally Posted by grandville455

dark tan they are probably the white ones then. I would get the pink ones atleast. also u still need the back secondary blades set to where u adjust them to where they are closed than open about a half turn or so from that seated positon, transtion in front should be square. You do have your pump arms adjusted at WOT So they are not bottoming out the pump? If it won't idle drill some small holes in only primary blades to begin with.I would put a 50 pump on front too with a 37 and leave the back at 31 and 30 c.c pump

Yep, must be the white ones, albeit old and stained. Yes, pump arms are set to spec. Car idles fine. Will check the rear blades.

[quicksilver97ta]

Originally Posted by shaker455

Quick,

Dist:
If you have your initinal @ 19 then leave the vac advance unplugged for now.

You posted you have 18 degrees of mech adv so that is good if your at about 37 total.

Start up and shut off okay?

What RPM does it all your advance come in by?

Okay the Carb:

You have an 830...okay

You need a 50cc spring & housing to run a 50cc pump set up so you don't have enough parts.

You have a #218 cam and I have one here too....it appears almost white or slightly green.

If you have the Pink #330 cam try them as they will produce the most cc's per shot.

Green is the next one down from the pink.

Your plug looks slightly lean but you need to go out and put some miles on them to color up.

I figured that on the 50 cc pump parts deal.

I do have some pink cams to try, will do.

Slightly lean? Wow, I'm looking at the ring and that thing is pretty dark after running the 82's. But I did install those 84's last night so I'll leave them for now and just install the pink cams. Any trick to that? I havn't taken that part of the carb apart.

No problems starting or shutting off. Not sure when total is in, need two people. Can do on the vac adv but have to ask why?

Will try the pink cams and report back.

[quicksilver97ta]

Which hole on the pink? LOL Right now the white cams are at 2 on the front and 1 on the rear.

[shaker455]

Originally Posted by quicksilver97ta

I figured that on the 50 cc pump parts deal.

I do have some pink cams to try, will do.

Slightly lean? Wow, I'm looking at the ring and that thing is pretty dark after running the 82's. But I did install those 84's last night so I'll leave them for now and just install the pink cams. Any trick to that? I havn't taken that part of the carb apart.

No problems starting or shutting off. Not sure when total is in, need two people. Can do on the vac adv but have to ask why?

Will try the pink cams and report back.

Quick,
You got a name?...I'm Jeff.

Last time I checked the ring does not ignite fuel so you may want to look in the area where spark occours....LOL...yes I'm being a wise guy...

Look at the ceramic and the strap in the middle of the plug as that's where the spark happens...we'll get into that later.

Cams swap out easy and just make sure you see how it comes out and is orentated....try Pos #1

Do just the front one for now as that's where you had problems.

Must make sure the cam goes to the shaft and you gently move the return spring over a little.

You may need to reset the pump arm.

For now simply tighten the pump arm screw to compress the spring...then loosen it one flat at a time to take out any slack...that will get you going..

You know how to bench set it with a feeler gauge at WOT right?

Vacuum advance is simply a taylor that you run on a ported source espically with your engine's cam.

While power tuning you leave it out of the loupe to keep things simple...we'll deal with that later.

[quicksilver97ta]

Originally Posted by shaker455

Quick,
You got a name?...I'm Jeff.

Last time I checked the ring does not ignite fuel so you may want to look in the area where spark occours....LOL...yes I'm being a wise guy...

Look at the ceramic and the strap in the middle of the plug as that's where the spark happens...we'll get into that later.

Cams swap out easy and just make sure you see how it comes out and is orentated....try Pos #1

Do just the front one for now as that's where you had problems.

Must make sure the cam goes to the shaft and you gently move the return spring over a little.

You may need to reset the pump arm.

For now simply tighten the pump arm screw to compress the spring...then loosen it one flat at a time to take out any slack...that will get you going..

You know how to bench set it with a feeler gauge at WOT right?

Vacuum advance is simply a taylor that you run on a ported source espically with your engine's cam.

While power tuning you leave it out of the loupe to keep things simple...we'll deal with that later.

Hey Jeff thanks for the help! I'm Danny. OK! it likes the pink cam. Started at position 1 hole 1 and there was a slight but noticable improvment.

I then wanted to try pos 2. Note: this carb only has a 1 and 2 position however, this pink cam has 3 holes unlike the white cam with 2 holes. I could not try hole 2 in the cam. So I tried hole 3 in the cam which lined up with hole 2 in the carb. This worked well, hopefully it's not a mismatched deal?

It's now difficult to detect any bog in the primarys only. It's at that really picky point so I'm either there or really close and that was a huge step.


Now the secondaries do have a more noticable bog but it has actually improved as well. It currently has a white cam on pos 1, a 31 squirter, a blocked pv, and 86 jets.

[shaker455]

Hey Danny,
I think your there on the primarys for now but keep an eye on the plugs...there overall color should be like a light tan or coffee color.

Your all set also with the pink cam...pos is fine.

Go for it and now do the back cam if you haven't already.

I would try the 88 jets back there and see what happens and lets go from there.

What number heads are on there?

Also, I noticed your fuel filter which I'm glad you have one but who knows what's inside so maybe you can pick up this Wix filter #33003 and it will not cause any issues.

[shaker455]

Danny,
Found your #218 cam in the Holley book.

It a "white" cam and pretty much at the bottom of the scale.

Pink #330 cam is at the top of the 30cc pump scale.

[quicksilver97ta]

Thanks Jeff. I installed the pink cam on position 2 in the rear and it hated it. Gargle, backfire, and fire. Had to close up shop after that.

Later I found the following chart on the Holley web page. I also read some info about the cams different settings (pg 4) and it's not at all what I assumed with higher numbers like the jets and squirters. Those numbers are actually a delay with the higher number being more of a delay. So for this set up it definitely doesn’t like the number 2 setting in the rear. I will change it to 1 and see how that does. I’ll also jet up to 88 back there.

[Tom Vaught]

A lot of times I swap Pump Arms and Pumps and put the 50 cc pump on the front (as the front typically needs more fuel immediately) and the rear barrels (with the 50 cc pump) gets too much fuel.

Your Pink Cam in the rear in #2 position makes perfect sense for being unhappy.

Tom Vaught