[Racer81x]

Just a few things to add:

Couple years ago when JR spun himself out, they actually played his team radio on tv and caught him either saying to his guys if they liked that, or how was that


I remember 5-10 years ago when there was a caution for debris,there actually was and 99% of the time they actually showed it on tv, not anymore in the last couple years with the phantom debris cautions.

8 out of 10 races there is always a mysterious debris caution in the last 5-15 laps if the race has had a long green flag run, or if the leader is way out front. ( like stewart getting the shaft saturday night)

5-10 years ago almost everytrack was sold out and they didn't advertise that they still have tickets the week before the race, unlike now.

They would always show the stands and show that they were full, now they hurry up and switch camaras if they show a empty section.
A friend of mine who works part time at the track in charlotte, said they buldozed down several bleachers, because they were not selling out and that it looked bad on tv

I'm sure I have more to add, but thats all for now

[Racer81x]

Originally Posted by js1977

The day they start throwing right turns into the mix is the day I might start watching it... To be in the race car is one thing, but to watch 300 laps of left turns just doesn't catch my eye...

Hell just watch kyle busch, he usually has his car turned right quite a few times during almost every race.

[Sirrotica]

Speaking about Tony's car, for a car that was so fast and could run off and leave the other cars, I never saw a car so poor on restarts. Even with new tires it was like he was on ice each and every start he'd lose 2-5 car lengths and a couple positions. I know Tony can feather the throttle probably better than most anyone else out there by virtue of being a dirt racer, but he couldn't do a thing with that car, also it jumped sideways.

[js1977]

Originally Posted by Sirrotica

They run 2 road races per year and have been since the early 60s, so your a fan now?

Sonoma and Watkins Glen are both road races in case you just landed on this planet.......

Well I might just have to mark my calendar... for those two.

[MikeNoun]

I enjoy the road races more the most, followed by the short tracks, and far back on my list are the superspeedways, and WAY down on my list are the mile-and-a-half tracks, which are usually very boring. Not because I want to see accidents, it's because I like to see side-by-side action, and aggressive passing. The road races are the most fun, but NASCAR doesn't care for them.

Why?

First, the TV cameras can't get a get a bunch of cars all in on the same shot. Whenver they show a car, or mention a sponsor, they get paid. Secondly, road courses don't hold as many fans as the oval tracks do. And finally, it costs more to televise a road course, because they need more cameras around the track to capture all the action.

Road racing shows the true driving ability of a driver. I look forward to those 2 road races every year. The ability to master a road course made me a fan of Tony Stewart, Jeff Gordon, Mark Martin, Rusty Wallace, and Marcus Ambrose. The other guys aren't slouches either; Kasey Kahne, Kyle Busch, Jimmie Johnson, and Kurt Busch are all great road course drivers (not surprisingly, Dale Jr stated publicly he hates road courses).

Back to the "debris caution"....

They throw debris cautions to run more commercials and get more sponsorship air time. Every time a driver mentions their sponsors product during an interview, they get a bonus of $500-$1000. That's why guys like Carl Edwards and Michael Waltrip make me laugh. When interviewed, they run down the list of all their sponsors, sometimes even looking over at their car to name them all, and sometimes they forget to thank their pit crew or crew chief. Corporate tools, but hey, money is money.

[Sirrotica]

Did you see where the interviewer asked Ryan Newman if he could have his coke?

Newman said as soon as I take a drink of it you can have the rest of it......LOL.

[David Holmberg]

Nascar = WWF/WCW/WWC

Once the TV announcers are controlled by the promoter, it's over.

The bad part is, I'll still watch it. If I were in the car it wouldn't be NASCAR it would be a road course GT car, or Drag Racing. I have never had an interest in driving in circles.

[Racer81x]

My dad had went to the first race they ever had at talladega and went back to every spring one untill the mid 90's, had the same good 6 tickets for the daytona 500 from the late 70's till around 2003 or 4, had 2 tickets to the first race of the year in michigan from the late 80's to early 2000, and had 2 season tickets at the kansas track for 4 or 5 years.

He got tired of all the bullsh*t, raising ticket prices, they changed it at most tracks that you couldn't bring in a cooler anymore and would get raped at the concession stands, and finally the last straw was when nascar let toyotas into the sport and race

Now he hardlly watches it at all on tv unless he has nothing to do. He has been going to the chili bowl now for little over 10 years and that is a hell of alot more great racing.

[Sirrotica]

David, make 8 laps on a dirt track and come back and tell me again about driving in circles, anyway it's oval track racing, not circle track racing. Just driving with the wheels cut to the left isn't what's happening, 2 straightaways connected with 4 corners.

If your on dirt you'll be steering to the right more than the left anyway, if your doing it right.......................................

[Racer81x]

Originally Posted by Sirrotica

David, make 8 laps on a dirt track and come back and tell me again about driving in circles, anyway it's oval track racing, not circle track racing. Just driving with the wheels cut to the left isn't what's happening, 2 straightaways connected with 4 corners.

If your on dirt you'll be steering to the right more than the left anyway, if your doing it right.......................................

There so needs to be a "like" button on here! Well said, i'd rather race on a dirt track than drag race anyday of the week!

[David Holmberg]

Actually that would be fun, we use to race like that on snow when I was a kid. My Dad raced the dirt tracks in Michigan back in the 50's, he's the main reason I watch Nascar.

Its the ADD in me I guess, and anger issues. In NASCAR I'd be knocking everyone out of my way that pissed me off.

Like Mike, I don't care for the mile and a half tracks at all. Bring back the short tracks, please. I do, however, like the super speedways, again only as a viewer.

[The Champ]

Mile and a half tracks are not necessarily a bad thing. It's just that they built too many of them and the new one's don't have any character.

Charlotte is a mile and a half track and usually has some pretty exciting racing. Atlanta is a mile and a half and also normally has good racing.

The new tracks at Kansas, Chicago, Texas, Vegas, Kentucky, Homestead... Well, normally not so good.

Darlington is a one of a 1.336 mile.

Dover and Phoenix are both 1 mile - but totally different tracks.

Bristol is .533 and high banked - Martinsville is .526 and not as banked.

Richmond is a one of a kind .75.

Pocono is a 2 mile triangle.

New Hampshire is a flat 1.058 miler.

California and Michigan are 2 milers.

Daytona is a banked 2.5 and the Brickyard is a flat 2.5 miler.

Dega is a banked 2.66 miler.

And a couple of road courses in Sonoma and the Glen.

[uforacing]

Originally Posted by Cobrabill

If you can turn left,you're driving too slow.

I have to say that with all of your posts I have kept my mouth shut till now. I take it you have never raced on a track in your life. Nothing but armchair BS and hot air. Having raced both road courses and ovals both have there unique set of skills involved.

Reason why many of the so called modern greatest ones have issues when called upon to do something as simple as go around in circles. Many of the modern stars in Nascar have done both. I am not defending the sad state it has become but you seem to think that any driver that does not turn right on a normal basis is somehow inferior.

Looking back on my short career (10 years) that I raced Karts, Midgets and FF I understand the different mind set and techniques required of both. I raced nothing but road courses then progressed to ovals in both dirt and asphalt. then back to road courses while driving ovals as well.

If one learns these at an early age I feel they are more the better from it. The first time I raced on an oval on the dirt I was so stoked. Everything I had watched and learned from my father came to life. For me it was all about applying what I had been taught.

Having raced nothing but road courses for the first 5 years of my career I learned. And the above dirt indoctrination came 3 weeks after I won a NW title in Karts.

So tell us of your amateur/professorial career in racing?

I will put up my pics after you put up yours.

Since turning left is just so easy.

[Sirrotica]

Originally Posted by uforacing

I have to say that with all of your posts I have kept my mouth shut till now. I take it you have never raced on a track in your life. Nothing but armchair BS and hot air. Having raced both road courses and ovals both have there unique set of skills involved.

Reason why many of the so called modern greatest ones have issues when called upon to do something as simple as go around in circles. Many of the modern stars in Nascar have done both. I am not defending the sad state it has become but you seem to think that any driver that does not turn right on a normal basis is somehow inferior.

Looking back on my short career (10 years) that I raced Karts, Midgets and FF I understand the different mind set and techniques required of both. I raced nothing but road courses then progressed to ovals in both dirt and asphalt. then back to road courses while driving ovals as well.

If one learns these at an early age I feel they are more the better from it. The first time I raced on an oval on the dirt I was so stoked. Everything I had watched and learned from my father came to life. For me it was all about applying what I had been taught.

Having raced nothing but road courses for the first 5 years of my career I learned. And the above dirt indoctrination came 3 weeks after I won a NW title in Karts.

So tell us of your amateur/professorial career in racing?

I will put up my pics after you put up yours.

Since turning left is just so easy.

:

Anyone that thinks oval track or road racing is simple just borrow someones car that's the slowest class there is and run a heat race.

I doubt you'll wanna climb back into a straightline car.

I know a guy that had been drag racing since he got a drivers license and regularly runs a car that is an 8 second car. He and a couple of his buddies built a spectator car, the slowest class there is and ran it at the local dirt track. He came out of that car white as a ghost and could hardly talk. It's not just driving in circles as some people seem to think it is. It's a pure adrenaline rush and after a feature race you'll be drained and exhausted.

It's easy sitting at home watching on TV to criticize something you really don't understand. Sit in a car and run 1 race and everything will become much clearer about oval racing........................

[sleepy]

When I got my car it came with a fiberglass seat wraparound on the right side only, Paid for it and took it straight to the track. made it into the feature by one spot, in the middle of the feature took the outside coming out of turn 2 and "rubbed" the wall. I THOUGHT MY GUTS WERE ON FIRE. cracked 2 ribs on the right side. Still managed 6th after starting 15th.
If you've never raced oval, You don't know how much of a workout it is,(even with power steering)

[David Holmberg]

FTR, I never said it was "simple", I just said I preferred turning both directions.

BTW, I've ridden with Bill, his talents would do better in monster truck racing as he runs over everything he can. (and some things he didn't mean too)

[Racer81x]

Originally Posted by David Holmberg

FTR, I never said it was "simple", I just said I preferred turning both directions.

BTW, I've ridden with Bill, his talents would do better in monster truck racing as he runs over everything he can. (and some things he didn't mean too)

If you are ever in NW Iowa, let me know, I usually have a couple spare figure 8 cars sitting around that i'll let you run, since you prefer to turn both directions

[David Holmberg]

Oh hell, I loved watching those race as a kid. Not something I want to try myself. LOL!

Sleepy, I also raced motorcycles and know exactly what you mean. My ex-wife never understood why I came home worn out from "just riding". LOL!

[falcon4]

When you dress like a clown and drive around in circles, what do you expect. Nostalgia racing is getting better and better each day. Bring on Trans Am dedux....

[Sirrotica]

Originally Posted by David Holmberg

FTR, I never said it was "simple", I just said I preferred turning both directions.

BTW, I've ridden with Bill, his talents would do better in monster truck racing as he runs over everything he can. (and some things he didn't mean too)

David, FTR my comment wasn't directed at you, just a general blanket statement for those that seem to think it's easy to do and the sport itself is overrated. Unless you've been directly involved in the sport, it's very easy to point fingers and criticize it.

My first hands on involvement was a partnership with a guy that considered himself a "driver" and I built the cars. I tired of watching the cars I built get passed when someone showed the guy a fender and the next corner he spun out. The partnership dissolved after 3 winless seasons and I built my own car and drove it (seen in my signature). They very first race I won (that hooked me for sure) and continued to win through 5 more seasons, after my daughter was born I quit driving and helped other guys running Pontiacs at the local level which also produced a good many wins. This has been my passion since I was 5 years old and I guess I get tired of it being trivialized on PY whether it's a NASCAR thread or just an of the cuff comment about oval track racing in general. For the record, I have also road raced and autocrossed, I just prefer oval racing on dirt. Drag racing I have also done somewhat, not to the level many have done here on PY, it just never captures me like dirt track racing does.

This is one of the first times on PY that others that have a passion for the sport have come together in the defense of the sport. And I realize that we're off topic here, just nice to see some that enjoy turning the wheel as they race their Pontiacs come together in support of what they enjoy, whether it's just spectating or actually participating.................


Asphalt's for gettin to the races, DIRT'S FOR RACIN ON!!!!!!!!