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Dragncar · 05-01-2012, 07:25 PM

If you welded up "that" spot on a iron Pontiac block it would eventually crack as sure as the sun is going to come up tomorrow.
Iron, heat lines, dissimilar metals, heating and cooling cycles.. all bad.

What is the insert made of, or is it secret ?

john marcella · 05-01-2012, 07:52 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by John Langer

That wont work. Want to know how I know... Knowing what I know from first hand experiences with n/a Pontiac engines, I wouldnt be brave enough to try that. Just sayin'. I fixed the problem but I guess there is more than 1 way to skin a cat. I didn't really have problems until I started making over 1025-1050 hp.

What rod did they use? And did they use a air hammer? Air hammer is the key to making the material really dense. Did it at least help for you?

65nss4spdGTO · 05-01-2012, 10:37 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by BruceWilkie

So... better cooling of the center head bolt area isnt as good a fix? Seems Rex and Langer have had huge improvement in head gasket life by creating a water passage where there wasnt one, and directing a separate cooling line to it. Not knocking what your doin there Calvin. Perhaps doing both would be even better

I do believe the issue is created by heat. I looked at doing the cooling mod, but if this works on it's own, it's much cleaner.

Calvin Hill
Hill Performance
708-250-7420

65nss4spdGTO · 05-01-2012, 10:40 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Mike Kasparian,Sr.

Has the cometic been surviving with this mod? Seems like the raised sealing embossment in that area flattens out with the heat then you just end up with 3 flat layers in that area. Good idea, hope it works out. MK

This is just going into testing with the Tiger head. The process has been used in other applications with good results.

Calvin Hill
Hill Performance
708-250-7420

65nss4spdGTO · 05-01-2012, 10:43 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by john marcella

What rod did they use? And did they use a air hammer? Air hammer is the key to making the material really dense. Did it at least help for you?

John,

I really believe it you don't get rid of the heat or use material that can handle high heat, the problem will continue.

Calvin Hill
Hill Performance
708-250-7420

Jack Gifford · 02:27 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by 65nss4spdGTO

... problems with head gasket sealing between the center exhaust ports...

I read through this whole thread, looking for a description of the failure mode, but didn't find it. Since you've designed a "fix", I assume the cause of the gasket failures is well understood?

John Langer · 05-02-2012, 04:43 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by john marcella

What rod did they use? And did they use a air hammer? Air hammer is the key to making the material really dense. Did it at least help for you?

Not exactly sure what rod was used but it didnt help at all.

Robert C. · 05-02-2012, 06:34 AM

Yes this has been proven to work on the Dirty Bird Engine. It helps when the Melting temp. of the material is over 3000 Deg. and aluminum is 1125 Deg.

It is places deep in the head well below the valve seats. He did this 2 years ago. It als pull heat away for the valves too.

Glenn Sedig · 05-02-2012, 08:17 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Jack Gifford

I read through this whole thread, looking for a description of the failure mode, but didn't find it. Since you've designed a "fix", I assume the cause of the gasket failures is well understood?

The web between the center cylinders after several runs is pushed down .002 to .004. The ridges in the head gasket also indent into the alum web by several thousands of an inch. The heat generated by 2 exhaust valves side by side in the center of the head softens the alum enough to cause this. The other webs with 2 intake valves side by side show no distortion or effects from heat. After the center web is pushed down, the head gasket has less clamping pressure on it which slows the disipation of heat. The head gasket starts to burn and allows combustion pressure to pass between the cylinders. What we need is to insert a probe into the web and see just how hot the alum is getting to know for sure what is happening.

rompn63 · 05-02-2012, 06:29 PM

I'm very interested in having this done. Is the work being done at Calvins, Glenns, or another shop?
What is the lead time on this?

65nss4spdGTO · 05-02-2012, 06:51 PM

Joe,

The CNC work is being done by another shop, but the final assembly and verification is done at my shop. I'll be out by Ricks within the next week, we need about a 7 to 10 days to turn this around.

Give me a call if you want to discuss this further.

Calvin Hill
Hill Performance
708-250-7420

Jack Gifford · 05-03-2012, 02:42 AM

Glenn- thank you.

rompn63 · 05-03-2012, 05:07 PM

I'm sending my heads for this modification Monday. I can't help but think it will help and can't hurt.
The proof will be at the end of this racing season when I pull the heads for inspection.

PONTIAC DUDE · 05-03-2012, 06:01 PM

What about 0-ringing the block and heads and doing this mod. Any issues?

Glenn Sedig · 05-03-2012, 06:28 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by PONTIAC DUDE

What about 0-ringing the block and heads and doing this mod. Any issues?

We have not tried to O-ring any heads yet, but it should not be a problem. The alum head and the copper alloy insert are fairly close in their rate of expansion from heat generate during combustion. The copper alloy will take much higher compresion loads than alum and machines well. It is tougher than alum so you would not want to crowd the O-ring cutter tool until you get a feel for how easy it cuts.

I hope to test my heads next weekend to see if the inserts with Cometic gaskets works well.

60man · 05-03-2012, 06:34 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Glenn Sedig

We have not tried to O-ring any heads yet, but it should not be a problem. The alum head and the copper alloy insert are fairly close in their rate of expansion from heat generate during combustion. The copper alloy will take much higher compresion loads than alum and machines well. It is tougher than alum so you would not want to crowd the O-ring cutter tool until you get a feel for how easy it cuts.

I hope to test my heads next weekend to see if the inserts with Cometic gaskets works well.

At what compression ratio ?? Just a thought..or does it matter?

taff2 · 05-03-2012, 07:09 PM

I've tried another way to remove heat from the centre exhaust ports area, I had a custom copper gasket made by Hussey's that is 2" wider on the exhaust side,this 'hangs out' in the breeze under the headers and hopefully it will wick away the heat from the affected area. I'm also dry decked and reverse cooled too. My combo is finally finished and ready for testing in a couple of weeks so I'll report back if it works. Combo is predicted to make around 1200-1400 hp.

bryansMtngto · 05-03-2012, 07:18 PM

we did something like that years ago on my friends 69 GTO 400 motor.Ran in superpro with a 400 shot Fogger kit. Would blow out the gasket right there and actually burned into the head. We had a Bronze alloy used. Never had a problem with anymore head gaskets. Did finally break the Crank. So he ended up going BBC. But i still got the heads, Sitting on the shelf for possibly another build down the road. heres a quick pic i ran out and took with my Phone.