[arbys]

Originally Posted by The Champ

1,000....

The Champ!

[hurryinhoosier62]

Originally Posted by The Champ

I was at the race in Kansas and there weren't that many empty seats. This shot is from my seats in the first row of the tower at the exit to pit road looking back at the last seats at the last section of seats at the exit to turn 4. The center section was full and my area was quite full also.



Yes, I know, there are some empty seats. But this is not the premier seating area and it's not like some other tracks where whole sections are virtually empty.

If NASCAR had small seating capacities like baseball or football - they'd be sold out.

We had a great time at the races and Kansas Speedway is a very fan friendly track!

IF things are SO ROSY for NASCAR, WHY are 45,000 seats being ELIMINATED at Daytona? I've got a couple of friends that go to Bristol religiously. They had NO PROBLEM getting tickets, where it used to be sold out for YEARS in advance. One race DOES NOT indicted a profitable season. What about Dover? HALF EMPTY........for BOTH races. Your answer?

[ho428]

Originally Posted by KS circutguy

They should have "Chump" take over the marketing campaign.lol
Who the hell still watches round de' round cars nowadays?

I haven't kept up with it the last month or so, I'm in the middle of my own 4 race stretch to the end of the season.
And, since Speed TV went away I can't keep track of where they're running or what's going on.
I guess the last one I sat down and actually watched some of was the Richmand fiasco, after that I pretty much didn't care anymore.
Saw a little of the truck race today, didn't know it was on but turned the TV on in the garage while working on the car, looked like caution after caution, then a wreck and a fight with a bunch of mouthing off afterward. Who gives a crap about the WWF? I mean NASCAR.

[hurryinhoosier62]

NASCAR has LARGE seating capacity, eh, Champ? If the had SMALL venues they would sell out? OK..............

Neyland Stadium (Univ. of TN)-102,455
Knute Rockne Stadium (Notre Dame)- 80,795
Michigan Stadium (Univ. of MI)- 109,901 (average since 1975: 100,000 per game)
Bryant-Denny Stadium (Univ. of AL)-101,821
Ben Hill Griffin Stadium (Univ. of FL)-88,548
L.A. Memorial Coliseum (Univ. of SoCal)-93,607
Lambeau Field (Green Bay Packers)-80,750
Camp Randall Stadium Stadium (Univ. of WI)-80,321

Now, let's look at NASCAR, shall we? These are all 2012 stats.

Atlanta-99,000 DOWN from 124,000 in 2011
Auto Club-84,000 DOWN from 95,000 in 2011
Bristol-158,000 1st race attendance:102,000 2nd race: 145,000
Charlotte-146,000 DOWN from 156,000 in 2011
Chicagoland-69,000 DOWN from 73,000 in 2011
Darlington-60,000 DOWN from 61,000 in 2011 (smallest decline)
Daytona-147,000 DOWN from 159,000 in 2011. To be REDUCED to 101,000 by 2016
Dover-133,000 1st race: 85,000 2nd race: 85,000 DOWN from 133,000 in 2008
Kansas-72,000 DOWN from 80,000 in 2011
Las Vegas-131,000 actual attendance in 2012:150,000
Michigan-84,000 DOWN from 108,000 in 2011 (24,000 FEWER seats than Michigan Stadium)
Richmond-91,000 DOWN from 110,000 in 2011
Talladega-109,000 DOWN from 143,000 in 2011. Attendance in 2008: 160,000
Texas-138,122 1st race:168,400 2nd race:151,100 2008 attendance: 191,000 and 183,500 respectively
Pocono-70,000 1st race:105,000 2nd race:85,000 2008 attendance: 105,000 and 130,000 respectively

Now, for the LARGEST track NASCAR sees: Indianapolis Motor Speedway
2012 seating: 230,000 DOWN from 257,000 in 2011
NASCAR attendance: 125,000 2007 NASCAR attendance: 270,000. A 54% DECLINE in attendance in 5yrs
2012 IndyCar attendance: 300,000+
From 2011 to 2012, total NASCAR seating (minus the 27,000 reduction in seating @ IMS) DECLINED 148,000 seats. That's 1,000 MORE seats than Daytona currently HAS. Your response?

[KS circutguy]

Hey,I'm still a fan,and wondering when she'll go back to faster F1 racing.And leave the podunk racing behind.
BTW;She's laughing all the way to the bank.

[400 4spd.]

Originally Posted by hurryinhoosier62

NASCAR has LARGE seating capacity, eh, Champ? If the had SMALL venues they would sell out? OK..............

Neyland Stadium (Univ. of TN)-102,455
Knute Rockne Stadium (Notre Dame)- 80,795
Michigan Stadium (Univ. of MI)- 109,901 (average since 1975: 100,000 per game)J
Bryant-Denny Stadium (Univ. of AL)-101,821
Ben Hill Griffin Stadium (Univ. of FL)-88,548
L.A. Memorial Coliseum (Univ. of SoCal)-93,607
Lambeau Field (Green Bay Packers)-80,750
Camp Randall Stadium Stadium (Univ. of WI)-80,321

Now, let's look at NASCAR, shall we? These are all 2012 stats.

Atlanta-99,000 DOWN from 124,000 in 2011
Auto Club-84,000 DOWN from 95,000 in 2011
Bristol-158,000 1st race attendance:102,000 2nd race: 145,000
Charlotte-146,000 DOWN from 156,000 in 2011
Chicagoland-69,000 DOWN from 73,000 in 2011
Darlington-60,000 DOWN from 61,000 in 2011 (smallest decline)
Daytona-147,000 DOWN from 159,000 in 2011. To be REDUCED to 101,000 by 2016
Dover-133,000 1st race: 85,000 2nd race: 85,000 DOWN from 133,000 in 2008
Kansas-72,000 DOWN from 80,000 in 2011
Las Vegas-131,000 actual attendance in 2012:150,000
Michigan-84,000 DOWN from 108,000 in 2011 (24,000 FEWER seats than Michigan Stadium)
Richmond-91,000 DOWN from 110,000 in 2011
Talladega-109,000 DOWN from 143,000 in 2011. Attendance in 2008: 160,000
Texas-138,122 1st race:168,400 2nd race:151,100 2008 attendance: 191,000 and 183,500 respectively
Pocono-70,000 1st race:105,000 2nd race:85,000 2008 attendance: 105,000 and 130,000 respectively

Now, for the LARGEST track NASCAR sees: Indianapolis Motor Speedway
2012 seating: 230,000 DOWN from 257,000 in 2011
NASCAR attendance: 125,000 2007 NASCAR attendance: 270,000. A 54% DECLINE in attendance in 5yrs
2012 IndyCar attendance: 300,000+
From 2011 to 2012, total NASCAR seating (minus the 27,000 reduction in seating @ IMS) DECLINED 148,000 seats. That's 1,000 MORE seats than Daytona currently HAS. Your response?

There is no room for facts in this discussion. Let's stick to opinions.

[67GTONUT]

I think even us NASCAR fanatics realize attendance is down. Personally, I dont mind it a bit..... Maybe one day I can get a room near Daytona for a reasonable price, instead of staying in Ormand Beach each time....lol

[400 4spd.]

If I was still interested in NASCAR this is when I would be going, too. If you've ever had to sit next to a 300 pounder at Rockingham, you'll know what I mean.

[hada76]

Originally Posted by KS circutguy

Hey,I'm still a fan
BTW;She's laughing all the way to the bank.

mind if I tailgate? (no tattoo in that pic)

[hurryinhoosier62]

Originally Posted by 400 4spd.

There is no room for facts in this discussion. Let's stick to opinions.

"You shall know the TRUTH, and the TRUTH shall set you free". Seems appropriate.....

[hurryinhoosier62]

Originally Posted by 67GTONUT

I think even us NASCAR fanatics realize attendance is down. Personally, I dont mind it a bit..... Maybe one day I can get a room near Daytona for a reasonable price, instead of staying in Ormand Beach each time....lol

MY brother-in-law lives at Port Orange. I drive up the morning of the race, leave my car at his house and his wife drives us right up to the gate.

[GT182]

I know one thing... Danica can lean on my fender any time if she wants too.

[63Banshee]

Originally Posted by The Champ

1,000....

bunk

[The Champ]

Originally Posted by hurryinhoosier62

NASCAR has LARGE seating capacity, eh, Champ? If the had SMALL venues they would sell out? OK..............

I won't bother reposting the fluff...

You list a few of the larger college stadiums and Lambeau Field in Green Bay.

The average NFL attendance league wide was 67,579 last year.

You failed to mention that the seating capacity at the Oakland Coliseum (Raiders) is only 53,200.

Why didn't you list any baseball stadiums? Because baseball is happy with crowds of 25,000 - 35,000 per game.

It's a fact that the average cup track seats a larger capacity than the average baseball or football stadium/field.

You mock the 125,000 that attending the Cup race at Indy this year. Yet that is nearly double the number that attend the average NFL game.

I attended the inaugural Brickyard 400 and as a result will never go back there again. Why? Not because the locals were unfriendly. Not because of a bad experience in Indianapolis. It's because the facility is absolutely the worst NASCAR venue for folks that actually want to watch the race.

Getting back to football AND baseball...

Football and baseball have a predominantly localized fan base - the vast majority of those attending the games drive shorter distances and don't stay overnight.

I attended the race in KC. We flew to the race and stayed 3 nights. My situation is not that unusual.

Ironically, my wife and I will be heading to the local NFL game today as we have season tickets. It's about an hour and a half drive each way.

If my total cost to attend 10 NASCAR races was the cost of the tickets, a half tank of gas and the cost of something to eat and drink at the race - I'd do it.

What's funny is - after all the time you spent detailing stadium capacity for a very few football venues and looking up NASCAR attendance numbers - NASCAR is routinely drawing more fans to most of their Cup races than football attracts to a very small minority of it's venues.

Your response?

[hurryinhoosier62]

Hmmm.....ostrich(YOU) with his HEAD in the sand. NASCAR HAS a problem and YOU refuse to see it. Take a look at your beloved Kansas. Seating REDUCED by 8,000 seats to 72,000. I don't see NFL teams, MLB teams or NCAA Division I teams REDUCING seating in their LARGEST venues. Funny, I used to live in Indy. My apartment (back in my bachelor days) was close enough to IMS to hear qualifying and testing. I NEVER found the people of Speedway (IMS is actually in the town of Speedway) to be RUDE unless you did something REALLY STUPID. Keep drinking the Brian France/Mike Helton "Kool-Aid". A 54% LOSS of attendance IS not a NOT a positive growth pattern. TRY to learn something. Go to Jayski.com and STUDY the NASCAR attendance stats for the last 5yrs and tell me NASCAR DOESN'T have a BIG problem.

[The Champ]

Originally Posted by hurryinhoosier62

I don't see NFL teams, MLB teams or NCAA Division I teams REDUCING seating in their LARGEST venues.

Really?

Oakland Raiders to reduce capacity of stadium in order to avoid blackouts

http://www.insidebayarea.com/raiders...ce=most_viewed

That's why Jacksonville tarps off huge sections of their grandstands...

When the Twins built their new stadium a few years back, they reduced the capacity by over 10,000 seats. The new stadium seats just over 39,000. The old stadium could seat about 50,000.

Funny, I used to live in Indy. My apartment (back in my bachelor days) was close enough to IMS to hear qualifying and testing. I NEVER found the people of Speedway (IMS is actually in the town of Speedway) to be RUDE unless you did something REALLY STUPID.

Please REREAD my post. I tried to make it perfectly clear that I had no problems with the people in Indy. Heck they were extremely friendly.

It's the lousy facility that was never designed to watch the race. I remember at qualifying sitting next to a friendly local resident checking out NASCAR and him asking me what I thought of the facility.

I told him that if Indy was serious about attracting NASCAR fans that they needed to take down those grandstands behind pit road, tear down the pagoda and cut down the trees in the infield so that people could actually watch the entire race.

Evidently, from your attendance numbers, I was right.

Keep drinking the Brian France/Mike Helton "Kool-Aid". A 54% LOSS of attendance IS not a NOT a positive growth pattern. TRY to learn something. Go to Jayski.com and STUDY the NASCAR attendance stats for the last 5yrs and tell me NASCAR DOESN'T have a BIG problem.

I read jayski every day. I know attendance is down. The economy is down also. I've tried to point out (and you keep ignoring - talk about burying your head in the sand...) the fact that attending a NASCAR race is not like attending a ball game.

NASCAR is making more money per day than you or I make in a year. They are doing fine despite the economic downturn.

[hurryinhoosier62]

Horseflop. Their TV numbers are in the toilet as well. NASCAR has a problem. You listed 3 stadiums. Are you aware that Bryant-Denny Stadium set their all-time attendance record last month. Just shy of 102,000 people. THAT was for ONE game (AL vs UF). You see, the NCAA learned HOW to attract an audience and KEEP it. Still NO response on Daytona REDUCING seating from 147,000 to 101,000. BTW....THAT's NASCAR's premier venue. I was there last February. It was the 1st time in three years that the back stretch seating had been open. There were STILL 6,000-8,000 seats EMPTY(WAG on my part). Compare the 2007/2008 numbers at Jayski's to the 2012 numbers and tell me NASCAR is FINE.

[Alvin]

Originally Posted by The Champ

Alvin - you need a better source for racing news.

When I posted about this yesterday - it had already been determined that Ricky would be repairing his car.

May I suggest either www.jayski.com or www.mrn.com

I've found both sites to have very current and accurate info.

No need for any other source really...due to my lack of any real interest in the "touring princess" other than beating the last strands of hair from the dead horse hide here. Funny, this very morning Bing.com headline topic "Danica Wrecks Chevy" is her SOP. How exciting?

My recent goal here was simply to propel this thread past the 1,000 post mark. Congrats on your achieving that trophy.

My job here is done.

[Alvin]

Originally Posted by KS circutguy

Hey,I'm still a fan,and wondering when she'll go back to faster F1 racing.And leave the podunk racing behind.
BTW;She's laughing all the way to the bank.

That was IndyCar NOT F1...an epic divide in difference of vehicles. As Jim Wangers is famous for saying: "No way, no how" could the "pretend" 'champion' driver Wanica make it in F1.

[arbys]

I must say that NASCAR got more posts than F1 or Indy cars combined.