[mike76]

Which is best for a mostly street driven( some strip time) T/A for max power ,torque and drivability ? Combo is:
462" w/ Edelbrock 340 cfm heads
Beefed up TH 400, 1 7/8" headers w/full 3" exhausts
Assume each cam has the same duration( 250*ish intake and 650" valve lift)
Looking to make 660-670 hp @ flywheel .
All other components are the same to support this power level. Only difference is in the cam .
Thanks for your thoughts! Mike

[tom s]

Mostly street driven and drivability in the same breath as 670 flywheel HP?Glad it will be yours.Tom

[grandville455]

Go with Hyd with solid lifters

[Lee]

For what your goals are, solid roller.

You need a decent amount of rpm to make that power. To control the valvetrain (Pontiacs are not the lightest) you will need a decent amount of spring pressure. A solid will allow you to use all the spring pressure you need.

[BigB]

I am currently running a similar combo with a hydraulic roller cam with solid roller lifters. I want to do more driving, say 150-200 miles as opposed to my normal 30 at most. I will be changing over to hydraulic rollers and changing my springs. The solid roller lifters with high lift cam in my combo is going kill my springs one day. So my vote would be to go hydraulic from the start and save yourself some money.


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[jonmachota78]

Originally Posted by Lee

For what your goals are, solid roller.

You need a decent amount of rpm to make that power. To control the valvetrain (Pontiacs are not the lightest) you will need a decent amount of spring pressure. A solid will allow you to use all the spring pressure you need.

Makes perfect sence to me ^^^^. You're gonna have to wind it up for all that.
I still have trouble discounting the horrors of loosing solid lifter needle bearings on the street after a couple thosand miles. However, the hybrid, tight lash setups don't seem to suffer from that problem.

[68WarDog]

Similar objective of 70 GTO project. All components needs to complement each.Premium SFI flywheel, torq converter, 1350 joints, drive line.NO STOCK components. Rears are debatable with the A body crowd. I prefer 9" at a certain level. Good luck

[PONTIAC DUDE]

Hyd roller lifters with Beehive springs and titanium retainers. Uses less spring pressure and still maintain lots of street time. Less load, wear and tear.

[66bonne]

Originally Posted by PONTIAC DUDE

Hyd roller lifters with Beehive springs and titanium retainers. Uses less spring pressure and still maintain lots of street time. Less load, wear and tear.

This is the set up that P-Dude put on my KREs and his custom grind hyd roller [262/266, .621 valve lift w/1.65 rockers, 4/7 swap]. Pump gas and street driven.
Mid 10s on motor and high 9s with a little juice pushing 'two tons of fun' down the track.

Give him a call.

Jim

[Lee]

Originally Posted by jonmachota78

Makes perfect sence to me ^^^^. You're gonna have to wind it up for all that.
I still have trouble discounting the horrors of loosing solid lifter needle bearings on the street after a couple thosand miles. However, the hybrid, tight lash setups don't seem to suffer from that problem.

I know where Warren Ksiez's old SR 455 T/A is now living. It has been running on the street since the late 90's with the same solid roller lifters, and has never lost a needle bearing.

My 7 liter SBF has been running the same EndureX roller lifters for over 5 years and many thousands of miles, no problem with those either (knock on wood!). My lash is .021/.024.

[mike76]

Thought that I would get more power w/a hyd. roller set up of the same lift and duration. Using the rule of thumb of needing about 10-12 more deg. of duration in a solid to equal a hydraulic.
How much are the EndureX solid rollers? Thanks, Mike

[Tim Corcoran]

Hope I am not Hijacking here but do the OEM hydraulic rollers have pin oiling?

[jonmachota78]

Isky EZ roll$ on the "roadpaver" would be killer on the $treet!! (Some day, sigh...)

[Steve C.]

I suspect to make 660-670 hp @ flywheel with 250*ish intake and 650" valve lift using a hydraulic roller cam is going to be a stretch.

For interest evaulate Jim's 3950 lb race weight in relation to his ET an/or MPH get an idea of the horspower involved. His with 495 cid, 310cfm heads, Dominator carb on Victor intake. Note his hyd roller with 262/266 duration, 0.621 valve lift w/1.65 rockers.

On a old 462cid combo with 310+ cfm Edelbrock heads and a 254 degree Comp XE solid roller I made 600 hp at 6000 rpm with a Victor intake and HP950 carb. It should of been better but it had a lousy 9.7 compression ratio. My current 4.250" stroke 505cid with the same induction made 660 hp at 5900 rpm with only 10:1 compression, it currently has a 257 degree Ultradyne solid roller with about 0.689" net valve lift. If I were to make a change to a hydraulic roller for a similar power level I believe I'd have to add some additional duration.


.

[grandville455]

He does have 340 cfm heads tho so he may require less cam, I think its doable or close to it...

[tom s]

Did I miss what CR and which intake and carb?Tom

[Steve C.]

I'll stick my neck out and suggest the infamous "Roadpaver" hydraulic roller ( Comp lobe 3115B) with 246 degrees intake duration and .4000" lobe lift in conjunction with solid roller lifters won't do it, not 660-670 horsepower.

ET/MPH = HP http://www.wallaceracing.com/et-hp-mph.php

Anybody out there with actual dyno numbers ?


.

[Steve C.]

Less cfm airflow involved but here are power numbers from a actual engine dyno sheet....

4.250" stroke, 4.180" bore, 305 cfm alum d-port heads, Torker II intake and 950 carb and the 246/252 "Roadpaver" hydraulic roller cam using solid roller lifters with a 1.52 rocker ratio. It made 589.7 hp at 5800 rpm. A long way to go to make 660+ hp.

[72LuxuryLeMansLa.]

Originally Posted by Steve C.

Less cfm airflow involved but here are power numbers from a actual engine dyno sheet....

4.250" stroke, 4.180" bore, 305 cfm alum d-port heads, Torker II intake and 950 carb and the 246/252 "Roadpaver" hydraulic roller cam using solid roller lifters with a 1.52 rocker ratio. It made 589.7 hp at 5800 rpm. A long way to go to make 660+ hp.


.

Wow! That cam was done at 5800rpms?

[mike76]

OKay. This is through SD perf. D.B. is supplying everything. for that projected power level. 340 cfm heads, 10.5 cr., specially tooled intake ,etc. I don't have much doubt that through his recommendations I will arrive @ this power level. Again... the original question... Why would one run solids on a hydraulic roller if a set of hyd. lifters will give me more vs the solids(10-12*). I've read here that is the "rule of thumb". What am I missing? Am thinking that the hyd. lifters will give me enough rpm w/o the ultra stiff springs needed for the solid stuff.