[KO]

Originally Posted by 65nss4spdGTO

Comp was the stepping stone to Pro-Stock.

The fastest of the fast with so many different combinations.

It proves why a conventional Pontiac will never compete in a HP/CI class against other brands.

Calvin Hill
Hill Performance
708-250-7420

I think I have a Pontiac combination that can compete. NHRA SS/CS 10#/CID WITH AT 10.30 index, 9.2x record cast iron inline valve only The Chevy combinations are using the 23 degree Bowtie Vortec head @ around 300 CFM. I think a iron Pontiac head can outperform that

[J.C.you]

Originally Posted by dci

The only thing I see keeping a Pontiac out of comp is someone willing to spend the money to do what it takes. If you walk through the pits and staging and look at some of wild set ups these guy's have. You will be blown away by their creativity. Some of the cylinder heads I seen on these cars look like someones science experiment gone bad. They have globs of weld,putty,and screws holding everything together LOL. I asked one guy how he keeps water in the engine and his response was. We don't run coolant anymore. We push it to the burn out box make a pass shut it off and tow it back. Comp people are in their own little world and the only thing that limits them is their imagination. Of course it helps having the funds to make it all happen. Now on the other side of the coin. Pontiac people are in their own little world. We try and keep everything stock appearing and low maintenance and rarely step outside our comfort zone. I am not saying that is bad. I am just saying I believe we limit ourselves by trying to be unique in our way. I have to say that it is cool to see a Pontiac with 6X heads run with a Chevy that has been modded out. I just want to see Pontiac's step up their game a little, and we are a little bit at a time. Our cylinder head selections now are very good and versatile. So the only thing we need now are Pontiac people willing to do what it takes to compete with brand X. There are a few that have stepped up to the plate, but we need allot more.


Don Johnston
DCI MOTORSPORTS INC.
330-850-5050 shop
330-628-3354 cell
Designer of the DCI Tiger Heads and the NEW DCI Ram Air 5 Heads !!!!!

Short story....I was in Meaux's shop some years ago looking over some iron,chebby comp heads he was working on. No water circulated in those, lol! Sometime later, I happened to pit by the comp dragster these heads were on at the track. The guy came over to check out my old goat, looked it over and said he wished he had not gone crazy and started comp racing. I took it as, he at one time had a car and enjoyed himself at the track and it had escalated into something that had turned into no fun......

[Tiger Paw]

There are probably some classes even in Comp where a Pont could compete. However, they would need to remember to stick around 250-300 fps intake velocity. Thing about Comp is to compete it becomes total commitment or s***loads of money. If you build your own engines you'll barely have time for a job and your family life suffers. After a while it isn't worth it. Thinking "anybody" can do it with brand X..... is easy to say, way harder to do.

[Tiger Paw]

JC, what kind car you putting that cool looking engine in? I got a nice light 1650lbs w driver 32 Bantam altered for sale.

[Chad Speier]

Originally Posted by Tiger Paw

There are probably some classes even in Comp where a Pont could compete. However, they would need to remember to stick around 250-300 fps intake velocity. Thing about Comp is to compete it becomes total commitment or s***loads of money. If you build your own engines you'll barely have time for a job and your family life suffers. After a while it isn't worth it. Thinking "anybody" can do it with brand X..... is easy to say, way harder to do.

Like I said, Comp is a way of life! Always been that way and always will be that way. Walk around the pits and look at the "family" style racing. I can name 10 father son teams or more.

250-300? Are you building a 600"?

[Tiger Paw]

No 600ci, just some numbers I thought I remembered. It's been 12yrs since I quit. Seemed like we were shooting for 250, but thought I'd heard target velocities were creeping higher.

Enlighten me!

[Chad Speier]

Originally Posted by Tiger Paw

No 600ci, just some numbers I thought I remembered. It's been 12yrs since I quit. Seemed like we were shooting for 250, but thought I'd heard target velocities were creeping higher.

Enlighten me!

They are all on the edge of choke. 350@choke and 260-280 average total induction.

[Tiger Paw]

So, the avg number was what I remember.

Thanks.

[J.C.you]

Tiger Paw, the motor will go in a 68 bird. It is built around the popular 275 radial classes.

A altered such as yours would be the hoot...., dragster, or ex pro stock car would be fun also! I think we could give the K boys a run for their money.

[johnta1]

A altered such as yours would be the hoot...., dragster, or ex pro stock car would be fun also!

I have a dragster that you could try it in?

[Tiger Paw]

Nice looking engine, should be handful in anything! I would love to see some more pics.

[65nss4spdGTO]

Originally Posted by KO

I think I have a Pontiac combination that can compete. NHRA SS/CS 10#/CID WITH AT 10.30 index, 9.2x record cast iron inline valve only The Chevy combinations are using the 23 degree Bowtie Vortec head @ around 300 CFM. I think a iron Pontiac head can outperform that

That Vortec head is a pretty good piece. I just finished a set of un-ported with creative valve work that went over 260 CFM. The valve size was 1.960".

Get that entry area opened up and flowing 300+ and make some noise, I would love to see a traditional Pontiac compete.

Calvin Hill
Hill Performance
708-250-7420

[dci]

Thought I would bring this back to the top. I'm not sure how this turned into a comp eliminator discussion, but if you look at comp cars. These guy's definitely think outside the box and maybe that's how we started down this path. I am a believer that someone with the resources can build a Pontiac engine with around 2.3 HP per cube with the parts we have available today. There a couple of guy's here making over 2 HP per cube right now and some of them are doing it with Edelbrock Performer RPM heads!!!!! If you would have told me just 5 years ago that someone would do that I would thought your crazy. Does anyone here no of a brand X engine that's used for class racing or bracket racing making that kind of power? It would be interesting to dissect their combo to see what it takes.

[GTOGEORGE]

Oh HELL hear we go...........someone is gonna post about a friend that races a JUNK CHEVY or a JUNK FORD that is making ungodly amount of HP.......BLA.......BLA.......BLA! You know it's always someone who knows someone! LMAO!


GTO George

[dci]

Apparently there aren't to many engines making 2.3 HP per cube normally aspirated out there, brand X or otherwise LOL. So it looks like our little old Pontiac's are holding their own with several here making at least 2 HP per cube !!!! I think we are way to hard on ourselves and place way to high of expectations on the people willing to venture into that territory. When in reality we are holding our own with these old Dinosaurs LOL.

[Stan Weiss]

Don,
What category or class are you talking about? If we ignore the money spent to build them. A SS/AH Hemi is producing between 2.2 and 2.3 HP per ci using modified original iron heads.

Stan

[dci]

No class just any engine making 2.3 HP. Money is not a factor when building an engine of this caliber so that doesn't matter. To play at this level is not for the light hearted. The SS Hemi's are an excellent example of what I am talking about although I don't think they are using iron heads anymore. I believe and I may be wrong that they got a aluminum head approved for that class.

[tom s]

Don,IMO because of the trend to build bigger engines it will be darn hard to get to the 2.3.If someone wanted to throw the money at a aftermarket block 366 type engine it might happen.Tom

[mjm421]

As Don stated, there are a few bigger inch motors out there over 2.0. It could be done.

[tom s]

Stan,is NHRA SS hemi 440 CI making at 1000 HP?