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wheneaglesfly · 06-24-2016, 10:11 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by ta man

SO single plane intakes aren't true street engines?

They can be.

Another way to gauge will it start up -20 - -30 F & when its 100F - 140 F outside ?

Will it idle for 2 hours non stop without loading up the spark plugs like in Chicago or Los Angeles Traffic Jam & not overheat too ?

If it idles for 1- 2 hours, will the cam lobes survive or be wiped away ? Knocked down flat & Sheet shrapnel in the oil pan then ?

68azbird · 06-24-2016, 10:19 AM

740 hp if I give him my intake and carb.
FTTFMF

69Goat1 · 06-24-2016, 10:20 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by wheneaglesfly

They can be.

Another way to gauge will it start up -20 - -30 F & when its 100F - 140 F outside ?

Will it idle for 2 hours non stop without loading up the spark plugs like in Chicago or Los Angeles Traffic Jam & not overheat too ?

If it idles for 1- 2 hours, will the cam lobes survive or be wiped away ? Knocked down flat & Sheet shrapnel in the oil pan then ?

What does a dual plane intake have to do with any of that? I have ran several Victor intakes Pontiac engines and I have never noticed anything but excellent street drivability. The ONLY reason I would ever run anything else is because of hood clearance issues...

wheneaglesfly · 06-24-2016, 10:32 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by 69Goat1

What does a dual plane intake have to do with any of that? I have ran several Victor intakes Pontiac engines and I have never noticed anything but excellent street drivability. The ONLY reason I would ever run anything else is because of hood clearance issues...

Its just some of the OEM Style Testing done.
What made a Pontiac V8 Great original .
Passed these tests with Flying colors since Day 1.

The New Supercars have to pass these tests today.

I know all have Drag Racing on thier mind.

Drag Race Cam + Big Cub Poncho + Dual Plane works out nice.

wheneaglesfly · 06-24-2016, 10:34 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by gtofreek

Here is what I guessed last night.

647 HP @ 6500, and 678 Ft. Lbs. @ 4500.

We shall see!

650 HP.

700 FT/lbs

wheneaglesfly · 06-24-2016, 10:36 AM

When the Chevies & Mopars Blow up Street Racing....
Your Poncho Pontiac Lives on.

slowbird · 06-24-2016, 11:44 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by wheneaglesfly

They can be.

Another way to gauge will it start up -20 - -30 F & when its 100F - 140 F outside ?

Will it idle for 2 hours non stop without loading up the spark plugs like in Chicago or Los Angeles Traffic Jam & not overheat too ?

If it idles for 1- 2 hours, will the cam lobes survive or be wiped away ? Knocked down flat & Sheet shrapnel in the oil pan then ?

Where in Chicago are you from? I haven't seen -30 degrees or 140 degrees here. How does your car run in those conditions?

68azbird · 06-24-2016, 12:11 PM

Why does almost every PY thread end up on the outer reaches of another galaxy?

Don 79 TA · 06-24-2016, 12:14 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by slowbird

Where in Chicago are you from? I haven't seen -30 degrees or 140 degrees here. How does your car run in those conditions?

i'd gather if its 140 out, probably have other things to worry about besides driving your pontiac

same goes for -30 yikes....

OLDFLM72 · 06-24-2016, 12:59 PM

650/675

Donovan · 06-24-2016, 01:06 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by gtofreek

Except for the weight, cast iron is much better for an engine block than aluminum.

all together compared to the all iron engine, how much weight is saved with this engine? For some reason I feel like the crank size and those sleeves keep it from being a lot.

Thank you for taking the effort to share your work, it's really satisfying to see!

Donovan · 06-24-2016, 03:01 PM

617.2 HP
644 lbft

gtofreek · 06-24-2016, 10:28 PM

A factory iron block is somewhere around 175 lbs. An iron All Pontiac IA2 block is somewhere around 240 lbs. I would say. This block with sleeves, I'm guessing is around 125 lbs.[much easier to move around and flip over than an iron block]. The crank is maybe a couple lbs heavier than a 455 crank. The rods are lighter than stock rods, and so are the pistons. With the aluminum heads, and intake, I'm guessing this thing weighs around 500-525 lbs. A stock factory 455 is around 610 lbs.

So to answer your question, I'm guessing you'd save somewhere around 75-100 lbs.

Quote:

Originally Posted by Donovan

all together compared to the all iron engine, how much weight is saved with this engine? For some reason I feel like the crank size and those sleeves keep it from being a lot.

Thank you for taking the effort to share your work, it's really satisfying to see!

BB70 · 06-24-2016, 10:31 PM

Paul, do you loctite the head- main studs into the block or what do you do? Does it matter if the block is aluminum or iron ? As always, thanks for showing us your work ! I say 650 hp, 615 tq.
John

gtofreek · 06-24-2016, 10:56 PM

OK, the dyno pulls have been made! And we have two winners, one on HP, and the other on torque. Yours truly nailed the peak torque EXACTLY! And the HP winner is Donovan who was only off by 1.7 HP.

Drum roll.................................678.4 ft. lbs. at 3500 rpm, and 615.5 HP @ 5700.
It made 557.3 Ft. Lbs @ 2400 RPM! Made over 600 Ft. Lbs. from 2700 rpm[610] to 5300 rpm. It made 670 or better from 3300-4100 rpm.
The lowest torque was 438 ft. lbs @ 6700 rpm.

It made over 500 HP from 3900-6700 which was the end of the pull, where it still made 556 HP.
It made over 600 HP from5200-6100 rpm.
The lowest HP was 257 @ 2400.

I'm sure it's capable of a fair amount more as we ran it with a customers 4150 Holley carb on an RPM intake. I think with a Victor intake, and this carb re-jetted, it would have probably been in the 650-675 HP range. Probably up around 700 ft. lbs. also. The engine is going to be fuel injected in the car, so we saw no reason to re-jet this carb and keep flogging it to find an absolute peak power. We mainly wanted to get it running, re-lash it hot, make sure all is well, and see what it likes for timing. It liked 37° total. At 35°, it made 607 HP, and at 39°, it made 607 HP, but when I got it at 37° it made 615.5 HP. A/F ratio was a tad lean, probably could have used a couple sizes bigger jet, but all in all, it ran great. Absolutely no smoke or oil coming out the open breathers, nor did any oil come shooting out of the dipstick tube! LOL! Sounds pretty damn good. I will post some videos on you tube later.

I'm not sure why I'm so good at guessing torque of engines, but when we dyno engines, I'm almost always within a few ft. lbs. of what they do. I'm usually within 10-20 HP also. This time not. But the last two engines we dynoed, I nailed the torque exactly. I look at the engine and the specs, and numbers pop into my head. I found in the past, when I deviate from those numbers, I end up wrong, so I stick with them, and usually right. When I told my customer 678 Ft. lbs. he said he thought that was low, and that he thought around 700. I said, I'm sticking with my 678 because I found to always trust my initial instinct. Now to dial in those HP number a little closer!

gtofreek · 06-24-2016, 11:02 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by BB70

Paul, do you loctite the head- main studs into the block or what do you do? Does it matter if the block is aluminum or iron ? As always, thanks for showing us your work ! I say 650 hp, 615 tq.
John

No, I never Loctite the studs in. Especially in aluminum. They go in finger tight, with oil on the threads, and the nut torqued from there, with ARP lube. Removing studs that have been Loctited in with red Loctite, are a pain to remove. You have to heat the crap out of them to melt the stuff. They would have to get torqued down before the Loctite cured also. Never really seen a need to do it. If they get torqued properly, they don't come loose.