About Us

Jim Robertson · 03-05-2018, 03:18 PM

Who has run a partially (filled to bottom of water pump holes) filled OEM Pontiac block on both strip and street? I am planning a 700hp 455 build and wanted to be able to take the car on 300+ mile highway trips as well as 1/4 mile drag race it. I have a partially filled block now and did not want to start over. Was looking for real world experience with partially filled blocks on the street.
Thanks.

oldblueponcho · 03-05-2018, 03:46 PM

My block is partially filled [to the bottom of the freeze plug holes]. I haven't had any problems with it, but the climate where I live - left coast of Canada, is not near as hot as Texas.

GTO Dan · 03-05-2018, 04:59 PM

Hi Jim.

I ran a 1972 455 block that was 60 over on the street and strip for several years. It was filled to the bottom of the water pump holes. I kept an oil temp gauge on it and found it would run as high as 250*. I put an Earls oil cooler on it and that kept the oil temps in line. The cooler was mounted in front of the engine radiator. I used electric fans for the engine that had an override and would run them if the oil temp got too hot sitting in traffic.

Steve C. · 03-05-2018, 05:17 PM

Related topic:

http://forums.maxperformanceinc.com/...ght=block+fill

.

tom s · 03-05-2018, 05:20 PM

Jim,I have run 2 diff short filled blocks on the street.They aways ran cooler water temps than any other engines.I never had a oil temp probe.I just ran 10-30 Mobil 1 and closed my eyes.Both engines have been running fine for a lot of years.Tom

ta man · 03-05-2018, 05:23 PM

I have one, limited street miles on it so far but no real issues. I'm just using a canton 400 pan for extra capacity..temps normally sit at 190 for oil..oil will creep up to 210 in town and down the highway if I get the revs up for an extended time. I fully expected to need a remote filter and a oil cooler when putting the build together. I switched to synthetic after 200 miles which tolerates more temp. 190/210 is great temp with synthetic a steady 230/240 is fine.

Hooter · 03-05-2018, 05:24 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by tom s

Jim,I have run 2 diff short filled blocks on the street.They aways ran cooler water temps than any other engines.I never had a oil temp probe.I just ran 10-30 Mobil 1 and closed my eyes.Both engines have been running fine for a lot of years.Tom

I have the same experience on my old 467. Ran cool, never monitored the oil temps. Still on the street in a buddies car 10 plus year since the build.

chiefbigb · 03-05-2018, 07:13 PM

X2 on the larger capasity pan.

Steve C. · 08:10 PM

Keep in mind Canton oil pan capacities are listed as system capacity. This includes the oil in the pan and the filter. So according to them, in theory, IF their pan is listed as 6 quarts it is for 5 in the pan and 1 for the filter. One is 6 qt and the other is 6.5 qt. That said, most popular oil filters do not hold 1 quart of oil.

.

slowbird · 03-05-2018, 08:04 PM

Jim (i know this is off topic) what heads you planning on using?

ponjohn · 03-05-2018, 08:34 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by GTO Dan

Hi Jim.

I ran a 1972 455 block that was 60 over on the street and strip for several years. It was filled to the bottom of the water pump holes. I kept an oil temp gauge on it and found it would run as high as 250*. I put an Earls oil cooler on it and that kept the oil temps in line. The cooler was mounted in front of the engine radiator. I used electric fans for the engine that had an override and would run them if the oil temp got too hot sitting in traffic.

How did you plumb the lines?

BruceWilkie · 03-05-2018, 09:11 PM

Majority of heat is in cylinder heads. Cool them first ! (Heat rises).

Half-Inch Stud · 03-05-2018, 09:28 PM

So i got an original print of the Pontiac straight-8 Paper with Oil temp discussion showing that full length CYL water jackets show recuced oil temperatures.

So that was used as a baseline in the V8 CYL water jacket design.

So, i've Half-filled several 455 blocks with that cement and they seem okay. My +060 455 seems to run just fine in Alabama heat: 9:1, No mech fan, elec fan only when needed. Temps seem to behave.

Properly implemented Oil cooler still sounds like a good idea.

Mike Davis · 03-05-2018, 09:40 PM

No problems that I have encountered. I have run 2 different 421/428 3.25 Main blocks filled to the bottom of the pump holes. Limited street use but do drive it occasionally (some 50+ mile trips in the GA heat). Twist the engine 7100 at the track, made 780HP. Run 5W-30 Royal Purple XPR and change it about every 40 passes.

GTO Dan · 03-05-2018, 10:23 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by ponjohn

How did you plumb the lines?

Through a remote oil filter.

Jim Robertson · 03-05-2018, 10:56 PM

Good stuff. Thanks for the quick replies. I have run a partially filled block on the street in my 71 Trans Am. My .040 1971 455 was used as a daily driver for about 30K miles. Then during a freshen/upgrade I changed the rings, bearings, an added solid cam and a Warrior with a 1050 Dominator...and I filled the block. I used it for short street trips to the track and back for about 8 years and about 2000 miles after the freshen. Engine developed serious and I mean serious blow by. During the last few passes the track manager would come by after a pass and ask if I blew it up. Engine ran fine until about 5000 rpm then...big time mosquito fogger. Unfortunately I did not have an oil temp gauge nor did I leak it before pulling it apart. I found the total seal (gapless second) rings were shot (annealed?) and the ring grooves in the pistons were excessively worn with .030" gap above the top and second ring on all pistons. I was trying to understand the cause of the ring failure/piston ring groove wear and had thought that maybe the partially filled water jackets caused the rings/cylinders bore temps to rise to the point of destroying the rings. Car ran a best 1/4 mile of 11.22 @ 122 and was a barrel of fun drive. Planning the next upgrade.

Slowbird:
Heads for this build are 73 SD's.

Half-Inch Stud · 03-05-2018, 11:12 PM

~23 years ago Gapless mosquito fogger....been there and done that.

~15 years ago had a Street fogger but thaaat turned out to be several lifted umbrella seals. Re-sealed them umbrellas and no more fogger.

Present day: gap rings, Unbrella seals with grip , and no signs of foggering. Hope that helps

Dragncar · 03-05-2018, 11:17 PM

You need to run .002 more piston clearance and .002 more ring end gap with filled blocks. The block probably should have been bored if you were going to go block fill.
When Dan Whittmore did my block he let the hard block cure for several months with a torque plate torqued down on each side. Said you will hear the pistons a little before it warms up. Should have .006 clearance.

BADDTA · 03-07-2018, 12:33 AM

Hey Jim

Jakes 434 is filled and he has run it for the last 4 years (untouched) all over hell. It has never overheated. He has gone on 2 hr one way trips multiple times. In the next few weeks we will freshen it up with a hone, new rings and bearings. Jake wants to spray it more this year. Haha. What's new.

Brian

BADDTA · 03-07-2018, 12:53 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Dragncar

You need to run .002 more piston clearance and .002 more ring end gap with filled blocks. The block probably should have been bored if you were going to go block fill.
When Dan Whittmore did my block he let the hard block cure for several months with a torque plate torqued down on each side. Said you will hear the pistons a little before it warms up. Should have .006 clearance.

Concrete cures in 28 days. What advantage is there in letting it sit for several months?

Brian

Menu

About Us