[Kelvin Poe]

Originally Posted by Kelvin Poe

There is no rest of the story. Yes, they were mildly ported before Dan got them, flowed around 355 cfm. But, he did a great job taking care of any and all issues they had. He originally got 388 cfm out of them. I sent them back to him a couple of years later to freshen up. He did a few other things to them, but I didn't have him re-flow them. He said they should flow a little better, though. As I said, he did a great job with them, probably in the 390+ cfm range after freshening them. I don't think anybody's gotten much anymore then that out of a set of standard port HP's. He also ported my BOP intake to match them. Dan's a good guy and for sure knows what he's doing. I have nothing but good things to say about what he did for me and my HP's. But, like the rest of us, he's human and he was wrong IF he told you a good set of HP's, at least standard port HP's, would run away from CV-1's. That wasn't the case with me. Like I said, LET IT GO, I'm done with this...

One last thing.... my car ran 8.80's before I pulled the heads and sent them to Dan. First time down the track after I got them back from him I went 8.60's. Then, 2 years of tweaking and tuning and him freshening them, I got it down to 8.38. So yes, he got all there was to get out of them.

[mysticmissle]

this will be my only response to this crap being dug again:
MANY years ago, the test i conducted was on my own dime. I replaced my $4000+ 72 cc cv 380+ top end with a set of used $2700(with intake and rockers) 330cfm 72cc hiports. these hi port heads were port matched only, no matter what anyone else tells you. rocker advantage cv1 1.8 to 1.6. same cam, same carb, same car, roughly 4 weeks later. Car was roughly 1 tenth slower with the hi ports. AS IT SHOULD HAVE BEEN! there are more details, to my cv experience, that would only invite more bickering. Anyone reading this only needs to factor in what happened next.
I sold my cv motor, at signinficant financial loss to divorce myself from the perpetual BS and move on to enjoy actual racing vs keyboard racing. I also sold the ''ultra special, as cast 330 cfm hiport top end.'' I will never be another ''test pilot'' for someone's great idea, pontiac or other wise. lesson's learned the hard way. I have no doubt the current offering is an improvement over what I had. I also know, that if it was ''built'' by a professional shop, BES, Cerralis, Butler, KRE, Anderson, etc, it may have been a fair amount better. I did it all myself, except for the cam, good and bad. Good luck in whichever direction you, the car owner or racer, not the salesmen or cheerleader choose.
I intend to be at Norwalk, we have some health issues in the house that may prevent that. however, If you see me there, stop over.

[BruceWilkie]

Kelvin, it doesn't fit his opinion so "something must be wrong".

Fwiw Jeff's car with cv1 actually went quicker than published as he sorted it.
About 2-3 tenths possibly 9.4's iirc(I'd have to see if I saved those emails). Very good for a street car NA !
He never published that afaik because he didn't want to be in the middle of a shxt storm.

Pretty ridiculous that a person spends money, does better, than made to feel he's not a Pontiac guy and has to spend more money and buy a more socially acceptable cylinder head to "fit in" ! Then ends up slower.
Meanwhile the other brands get new hardware and run it. Regardless if conventional or not.

[mgarblik]

The level of passion for the Pontiac V-8 platform is fierce and different from any other out there. It may stem from decades of neglect from the manufacturer themselves, GM selling out to the "corporate engine" idea. Ford and Chrysler always had "corporate" engines for their car divisions, GM did not. Pontiac people make up their own rules and then live or die by them. Sometimes they make little concessions to be more competitive or modern. We are no different and there are no rules for what is Pontiac. This has been debated in endless threads here. The CV 1's are radical and different looking. Not all canted head engines are the best or fastest out there, or every head would be made that way. For us, trying to run as fast as we can, our 'Pontiac" engine had to have some recognizable features of a Pontiac V-8. Eric and I sat down and made our own rules. 1. Stock bore spacing 2. A cast block that looks like a Pontiac 3. Pontiac timing cover, valley cover, valve cover. 4. Head design that represents something PMD offered OE or over the counter. It works for us and we have fun. Everyone has their own idea of what a 'Pontiac " is. I do recognize an LS engine or a BBC based "Pontiac" is not a "traditional Pontiac". Other than that, everything else is great! Have some FUN!

[slowbird]

Originally Posted by BruceWilkie

Kelvin, it doesn't fit his opinion so "something must be wrong".

Fwiw Jeff's car with cv1 actually went quicker than published as he sorted it.
About 2-3 tenths possibly 9.4's iirc(I'd have to see if I saved those emails). Very good for a street car NA !
He never published that afaik because he didn't want to be in the middle of a shxt storm.

Pretty ridiculous that a person spends money, does better, than made to feel he's not a Pontiac guy and has to spend more money and buy a more socially acceptable cylinder head to "fit in" ! Then ends up slower.
Meanwhile the other brands get new hardware and run it. Regardless if conventional or not.

Just curious did you read Jeff's response before you posted this?

[BruceWilkie]

Originally Posted by slowbird

Just curious did you read Jeff's response before you posted this?

I just read it. Acknowledge he could write a book. Long ago and things change, good and bad.

[Jack Ferris]

Originally Posted by Kelvin Poe

There is no rest of the story. Yes, they were mildly ported before Dan got them, flowed around 355 cfm. But, he did a great job taking care of any and all issues they had. He originally got 388 cfm out of them. I sent them back to him a couple of years later to freshen up. He did a few other things to them, but I didn't have him re-flow them. He said they should flow a little better, though. As I said, he did a great job with them, probably in the 390+ cfm range after freshening them. I don't think anybody's gotten much anymore then that out of a set of standard port HP's. He also ported my BOP intake to match them. Dan's a good guy and for sure knows what he's doing. I have nothing but good things to say about what he did for me and my HP's. But, like the rest of us, he's human and he was wrong IF he told you a good set of HP's, at least standard port HP's, would run away from CV-1's. That wasn't the case with me. Like I said, LET IT GO, I'm done with this...

And now, these heads/intake reside on my 535.

[Dragncar]

I can see where a CV would beat a std port E head or High Port.
But the simple fact of the matter they have not as of this minute beat the best E head. And anyone will tell you the High Port has more potential than a E head.

You guys need to find someone to build a CV engine that will beat Mikes. It would be a interesting, fun and expensive project. Not saying it can not be done, just has not.
It would be like putting a dirty sock in my mouth. Positive some would like to see that.

[BruceWilkie]

Originally Posted by mysticmissle

this will be my only response to this crap being dug again:
MANY years ago, the test i conducted was on my own dime. I replaced my $4000+ 72 cc cv 380+ top end with a set of used $2700(with intake and rockers) 330cfm 72cc hiports. these hi port heads were port matched only, no matter what anyone else tells you. rocker advantage cv1 1.8 to 1.6. same cam, same carb, same car, roughly 4 weeks later. Car was roughly 1 tenth slower with the hi ports. AS IT SHOULD HAVE BEEN! there are more details, to my cv experience, that would only invite more bickering. Anyone reading this only needs to factor in what happened next.
I sold my cv motor, at signinficant financial loss to divorce myself from the perpetual BS and move on to enjoy actual racing vs keyboard racing. I also sold the ''ultra special, as cast 330 cfm hiport top end.'' I will never be another ''test pilot'' for someone's great idea, pontiac or other wise. lesson's learned the hard way. I have no doubt the current offering is an improvement over what I had. I also know, that if it was ''built'' by a professional shop, BES, Cerralis, Butler, KRE, Anderson, etc, it may have been a fair amount better. I did it all myself, except for the cam, good and bad. Good luck in whichever direction you, the car owner or racer, not the salesmen or cheerleader choose.
I intend to be at Norwalk, we have some health issues in the house that may prevent that. however, If you see me there, stop over.

Jeff family and health are most important. Hope things improve so you can make Norwalk. I was in hospital from end of August til Thanksgiving. Somewhere around 13-15 transfusions I was hoping to get to Xmas. Doing ok still recovering.

We (Deb, myself and 2 of my daughters)will be at Norwalk if no setbacks. Spectating and shopping. Maybe come home with something interesting.
I'll look for you.

[GTOGEORGE]

Originally Posted by Dragncar

I can see where a CV would beat a std port E head or High Port.
But the simple fact of the matter they have not as of this minute beat the best E head. And anyone will tell you the High Port has more potential than a E head.
You guys need to find someone to build a CV engine that will beat Mikes.

Who cares if the CV head will out run an e-head or any head, seriously if someone else is buying it its what they wanted thats all that matters and besides racers have made good power with them! Who in the heck made anyone the Pontiac Police, its non of anyones business who buys what head and for what reason! E-head is not the quickest head out there anyways. As for Mikes car (its really not a good compairson) all someone would have to do is get close and keep it together and that would be a big win!
FWIW....if someone wanted the Baddest and quickest out there they wouldnt start with a pontiac anyways!!!


GTO George

[Jack Ferris]

^^^^^^^Best post.

[7T2]

Originally Posted by mysticmissle

we have some health issues in the house that may prevent that. however, If you see me there, stop over.

agree w/ bruce-
family and health are of utmost importance. godspeed, jeff
jim

[JSPONT]

d ports ttfmf!!!

[Anderson Port Development]

Originally Posted by slowbird

Im pretty sure the HP heads were as cast and flowed 330ish cfm

... the Pickett's were running an as cast set of HP's ?? ...

[Anderson Port Development]

Originally Posted by Dragncar

Are you planing on running Cvs ? Go for it.
Do you remember why he switched to the HPs? Had to be a reason.

... so you really believe he spent the money, and time to make the switch because he knew he'd go slower ?? ...

[Anderson Port Development]

Originally Posted by LiL Jack

I really don’t mind if someone has a slower car.

We all start out somewhere.

I still remember my first pass: 13.53@105 on 255-60-15 Goodyear Eagle St.
I was hooked from that day forward.

It’s all in good fun.

... lol, yeah exactly just like the time you absolutely trashed Robin Robert's CV-1 car for over a year, and you were gonna this and that to his CV-what motor, and then we all make the trip to Norwalk that year to race you, only to hear you say something very similar in the staging lanes to Robin ...

... "" Man, you go on ahead, i ain't got nothing for this car, you know that"" ...

... then after Robin basically said WTF ?? What about all that trash you were talking man ?? ...

... you said ""man, that's just the internet man, you know how that chit goes, it's just the internet man"" ...

... yeah, it really is all in good fun 10yrs later right Jack ?? ...

... all we want to know is are you coming to Norwalk this year with your car ?? ... because we are ... please insert your BS excuses below ...

[Anderson Port Development]

Originally Posted by Stan Weiss

Now that is interesting. So you are saying that the heads that P-Dude ran were modified.

Yet all we have for the last decade from the leader of the circle j*** / twilight zone is the out of the box ports are to large and the port velocity is to slow.

So did they ever run an out of the box head?

Stan

... yes, Dude ran a totally as cast CV-1 top end when he originally made the switch, and the car went ALOT faster, not just a tenth, more like a half of a second faster ...

... the SD top end that came later, had other upgrades under them made after the CV top end, like a solid roller and more compression, but the original back to back swap proved the CV's were way faster compared to the E-Heads, and that's a fact ...

[slowbird]

Originally Posted by Anderson Port Development

... the Pickett's were running an as cast set of HP's ?? ...

Yes Picketts did on that engine at that time yes. Looks like Jeff's post says i am correct.

[Anderson Port Development]

Originally Posted by Dragncar

I can see where a CV would beat a std port E head or High Port.
But the simple fact of the matter they have not as of this minute beat the best E head. And anyone will tell you the High Port has more potential than a E head.

You guys need to find someone to build a CV engine that will beat Mikes. It would be a interesting, fun and expensive project. Not saying it can not be done, just has not.
It would be like putting a dirty sock in my mouth..

Originally Posted by Dragncar

Barton is the one who told me a good set of High Ports would run away from CV-1s. The guy does top Pro Stock stuff so its not like he does not have credentials, he does.
Slick insinuated that they were ported since he said they came from a successful team.""""" But I do remember the Pickets running as cast HPs for a bit.
As cast, that makes sense ???????????????"""""""
"""""""And no, I personally don't like CVs.""""" lol If you are going to cant the valve you should rip the head off every inline Pontiac head there is. Something was not right, those things were supposed to be one head that could do it all.
((((((I take much joy when they can not beat a aluminum PMD RAIV type head.)))))

... it is really difficult reading your posts, as you are all over the place with your rhetoric, one minute it's all laughs and crap about CV's can't even beat Eheads or HP's then you turn right around and say the exact opposite ??? ...

... let me be crystal clear to you sir, EVERY SINGLE TIME CV's have replaced a set of heads, regardless of what they replaced, EHeads, Iron Heads, High Port Heads or even Tiger heads, the car went faster, or it made more power on the dyno, and that is a 1000% FACT !!!!!!!! ...

... even including Brian's Procharged 484c.i. combo with BES ported Eheads, which increased HP by almost 190hp !!!!! with an as cast Gen 1 CV-1 head and manifold ... so i'm guessing those Eheads were jacked up before BES ported those too ??? ...

... you seriously need to stop cutting your own throat with this nonsense, so how bout we focus on the applications the CV-1's have actually been tested and compared to vs the applications that they have not yet been tested and compared to ??? ...

... in your world you would have everyone believe simply because they haven't been used on a max effort NA build, or a bad boy Butler or BigChief Twin Turbo build, that they can't be competitive on a build of these kind, which is absolutely retarded given the track record the heads have gained so far ...

... but even after multiple times i've posted this information you still finish with this retarded BS ??? [QUOTE]((((((((((((I take much joy when they can not beat a aluminum PMD RAIV type head.)))))[QUOTE]

[PAUL K]

Originally Posted by Anderson Port Development

... the Pickett's were running an as cast set of HP's ?? ...

It has to do with air speed and csa.....lol