[The Boss]

Same as a gel-coat on fiberglass.

[Baron Von Zeppelin]

Searches on here come up with everything you dont want, practically

did find this
but there is more on here somewhere


from PY member North

For what it’s worth a key employee who worked for me in a steel wire mill years ago did his engineering apprenticeship at inland manufacturing in 1967-68 and he was on the endura nose team. The bumpers were painted as following: the inside of the super polished molds were painted body color, the steel frame was inserted, the “endura” materiel injected into the closed mold. Then the mold “baked” the bumper to cure it. Bumpers were then shipped to assembly plants prepainted for installation.

Apart from his recollection this is documented by an article in SAE magazine from that time describing the process. It is further supported by period MPC’s that list a different part number for each color bumper.
This is also why various factory documents state that 68-69 GTO’s couldn’t be ordered with special order paint like other cars were.

So original paint appearing bumpers maybe replacement bumpers (color bumpers were only offered in the parts catalog for short periods before being replaced with unpainted ones) or perhaps plants would paint bare ones if certain colors ran out?

Btw he told me that the early months of 68 production was a disaster due to air bubbles in the endura under the paint, the assembly plants had hundreds and hundreds of GTO’s waiting for bumpers. Lots of people were fired.

['ol Pinion head]

Originally Posted by Baron Von Zeppelin

I thought most seasoned regular readers already knew about this ?

One of our PY members worked for the off-site supplier.
Been some discussions in past , might be buried in unrelated thread topics.
Either in this section or 68-69 section.

I dont have any books on it
Mike Noun might have some data.
Search function on here is probably the best bet.

i couldn't // wouldn't make this up

Inland Machine was the GM Division that mfg the endura noses amongst a multitude of other needed components: weatherstrips, body bushings, motor mounts, seat buns, GrandAm nose covers, prehistoric urethane bumper fillers, ITM shifters, on and on...

Interesting history of Inland, mention of the GTO endura noses (pg 10 on my IPad)

http://daytonautoandmemorabilia.org/...Inland-web.pdf

[Baron Von Zeppelin]

I had a chance to buy an NOS 68 Endura at Charlotte Auto Fair Swap around 87 or 88.
It was that Springmist Green color (light green/silvery metallic)
Never mounted and never an emblem installed.

In mint condition in every respect.
After about an hour of marveling and examining , declined due to the 68 emblem holes , which was what kept swirling in my mind the whole time. I could have used a 69 unit and would have bought it instantly.
68 parts were SLOW SLOW movers back then.

That was on a Thursday
went back by every day still fighting the urge
someone finally bought it on Sunday
probably Ron Johnson

Never seen another one since

[notime]

I myself find it hard to believe they put color in mold before pouring endura material in. Im no scientist but as a painter I cant see how that would ever work. I've worked on original paint endura bumpers and have found overspray on the inside. I would definitely need to see some kind of documentation on that theory.

[Baron Von Zeppelin]

All of the process was cutting edge for the day

Think the paint was urethane/polyurethane (epoxy with catalyst)
Main reason repair/refinish lacquers and enamels wouldn't bond at the time.
Likely a mid-coat//tie-coat sprayed after the color , as a go between from the color to the endura material.

reverse technology


someone else can hunt down the SAE article that North mentioned.

Mike Noun or North might have more info / data
It has always blown minds , just thought most of you guys would already be past the initial shock at this point in time.

Not to make excuses for something i'm not looking at -
its possible they could have even dusted the trailing edges after curing - before removing bumper from the mold fixture (no exterior masking required)

It's interesting - but not my baby

[1965gp]

I’ve never heard this before but my knowledge isn’t on par with this group. Still, in 30 years of Pontiac specific magazines I don’t think I’ve seen a story on this and it would be a good one.

[Norwood]

Originally Posted by notime

I myself find it hard to believe they put color in mold before pouring endura material in. Im no scientist but as a painter I cant see how that would ever work. I've worked on original paint endura bumpers and have found overspray on the inside. I would definitely need to see some kind of documentation on that theory.

Well that’s two of us

[71JudgeFNG]

Originally Posted by Norwood

Well that’s two of us

This Hot Rod article references the process mentioned previously.
https://www.hotrod.com/articles/1968...r-of-the-year/

As great an achievement as the bumper material was, Pontiac claims that the development of the paint was even more significant. Inland Manufacturing Division at Dayton had been a recognized factor in foam technology for years, and when named as initial fabricators for the ’68 GTO bumpers, it was basically a relatively simple matter of perfecting a paint material for this specific application. It soon became apparent that the only paint suitable for the new bumper would entail an entirely new project for its development. Conventional paints simply did not possess the necessary flexibility.

The advanced quality of the paint and the technology involved is evident in the fabricating process itself. First the paint is sprayed on bare, solid nickel molds that have extremely smooth, plated surfaces. Then a .150-inch thick steel frame is placed into the mold, the cover half is dropped on, and the urethane is injected, heated, cured and removed, all without additional finishing and polishing. There is also no real limitation to color availability, since the present GTO range consists of 17 different hues.

[muscle_collector]

Originally Posted by Norwood

Well that’s two of us

mark me down as 3 I just cant get it in my head how you can paint something and then have something else attach to it and turn out the way the endura did and stay on for 50 years. but im not the sharpest knife in the drawer by any means.

[Bentwheelbob]

Seems hard to understand from a 1960’s technological standpoint, and from a common sense standpoint. That said, if they were able to spray cars with a special order paint color, they could have just as easily sprayed the endura front as well if that was the process.

[Norwood]

The process was only used in 68, or used through 72. How about 70-73 f body’s ?

[unruhjonny]

Since this is news to me as well, I would wager the process changed...
although the 'special order' black '73 SD Trans Am delivered with a red bumper and flares might suggest they carried the process forward.

[PurelyGTO68]

Originally Posted by Bentwheelbob

Seems hard to understand from a 1960’s technological standpoint, and from a common sense standpoint. That said, if they were able to spray cars with a special order paint color, they could have just as easily sprayed the endura front as well if that was the process.

The company that manufactured the endura bumpers only produced the standard colors available for that model year. They didn't have any of the special order colors so that is why the special paint cars had to have the chrome bumper.

The endura bumpers arrived at the final assembly plant pre-painted. Because the paint was a special type, it doesn't make sense to allow special colors. That would not be economically practical.

[north]

The other story that guy told me of his internship was the 68 Custom sport wheels (woodwheels). The 68 woodwheels were discovered to have a welding defect where the spokes welded to the hub.

Pontiac has a big safety campaign to get all of these wheels replaced (each dealer had to track down all customers who they sold a 68 woodwheel equipped Pontiac). All the stock of new wheels at the plants not yet installed were ordered destroyed. The possibility of a steering wheel popping loose from the column is an understandably alarming problem!

Many employees at the home plant had taken advantage of this and installed these good looking wheels on whatever car they owned.

Word got out on the coconut wireless that the brass had gotten wind of this and an inspection of all employee cars was planned for the next day.

The next day saw record absenteeism at the plant with 100’s of employées calling in sick! Hopefully most of them had kept their original steering wheels!

[Brewster]

Ha. Funny. I can see that happening back in the day.

[Judge273]

The chrome bumper theory works for 68-69...after that not so much.

My guess is they had paint available after that. OO was on 70 GTOs, and special paint cars were available. Adriatic Blue TA got is stuff all in correct color.

[unruhjonny]

/\ the special order 1972 TA"s area GREAT point...
Which begs, why did Pontiac make such a big deal of custom order colours for Trans Am's in 1973?

[PurelyGTO68]

Originally Posted by Judge273

The chrome bumper theory works for 68-69...after that not so much.

My guess is they had paint available after that. OO was on 70 GTOs, and special paint cars were available. Adriatic Blue TA got is stuff all in correct color.

Good point.
Sounds like the process changed for 1970 and later. The 68-69 process has to be pretty expensive. With plans to begin using flexible noses on other models they probably developed a more cost effective process. Were the later noses heavy like the 68-69 units of were they more like skins?

Sent from my SM-G930V using Tapatalk

['ol Pinion head]

The entire discussion on how '68+ endura noses were painted has derailed the original topic

Moderator... Time to clean this one up for a new topic...


Molded endura noses were used on the following: Nearly all such endura noses are heavy.

'68 & '69 GTO's
'69 Camaro (optional)
'70 GTO's
'71-72 GTO's & T-41 LeMans
'70 1/2-72 Firebirds
'73 Firebirds
'73-74 Chevrolet Laguna S-3's
??? believe grille surround on early 2nd RS Camaro's (???)

Other company usage included:
Dodge & Plymouth E-body elastothermic bumpers
some 71-73 Mustangs
some Mustang II's
some mid 70's -77 Ford Capri
late '70's VW Dashers