[blueghoast]

Did the rocker arm come loose ?
I've seen that break a tie bar.

GT

[Tim Corcoran]

Rocker arm did not come loose valve spring is fine no indication anything else was wrong. It was tapping but not bad so I went in to take a look not happy with what I found. They are Johnson 2112OPR lifters I purchased several years ago and just getting around to using them in a new motor. Less than 500 miles so there must have been something wrong with the lifters for this to happen. Cam lobe is ruined and lifter will not come out. After I pull the engine I will need to drill out the rivet and slide it out from the bottom. I have contacted Johnson Lifter and talked to Joe Lewis on the phone. I have turned in a claim on their website. I'm not sure if Johnson will do anything for me. I hope they will do a failure analysis. Being it has been a long time since purchase and I no longer have the receipt I don't know if they will do anything.

[65madgoat]

21120PR perhaps you meant?

[Tim Corcoran]

Yes 2112OPR is correct

[AG]

A lobe on my brother's billet roller got similar damage using using CC 857S when they first came out, bought the set around 2016. The plunger got stuck down and the roller wheel broke. I sent the cam back to CC and they welded it up and reground the lobe good as new.

[Formulas]

I wonder if the link bar holes are the issue, I wonder if the hole is punched after heat treating the bar and then the punchwork starts a crack or stress riser... I imagine they are heat treated at sometime so they don't wear fast, And a bean counter would probably prefer punched hole vs. a drilled hole

[Tim Corcoran]

Originally Posted by AG

A lobe on my brother's billet roller got similar damage using using CC 857S when they first came out, bought the set around 2016. The plunger got stuck down and the roller wheel broke. I sent the cam back to CC and they welded it up and reground the lobe good as new.

Did they give you a new set of lifters?

[65 Lamnas]

Originally Posted by Tim Corcoran

Yes 2112OPR is correct

Well SHIIIIIIIITTTTT!!!!!!

[AG]

Originally Posted by Tim Corcoran

Did they give you a new set of lifters?

They fixed the cam for free and gave me a new set of lifters. I had all receipts, pictures etc documented. 10 out of 16 lifters had stuck plungers and I followed the install instructions to the T. I figured out it was the the anti corrosion goop they assembled them with using another set I had that caused the stuck plungers.

[JLMounce]

Originally Posted by AG

They fixed the cam for free and gave me a new set of lifters. I had all receipts, pictures etc documented. 10 out of 16 lifters had stuck plungers and I followed the install instructions to the T. I figured out it was the the anti corrosion goop they assembled them with using another set I had that caused the stuck plungers.

This is pretty much exactly what Lunati tech told me when I called them regarding the noise my lifters made. I inquired about why initially they were quiet, but after about 500 miles, the clacked.

I was told they use a protectant that can gum up and cause the plungers to stick. They recommended running Sea Foam through the engine and changing the oil, but that never helped anything.

The Johnson's I ordered from KRE and put into service immediately, I don't recall being coated with anything. They were dry, at least externally.

[AG]

I had a brand new set that I removed the C-clip and immersed them in toluene and plunged them numerous times until they moved freely. I couldn't believe how much black garbage came out. After cleaning them thoroughly I installed them without issue.

[P@blo]

Well this black goop tells me all I need to know. Before the parts come states-side, someone forgot to read the commie cosmoline removal memos? Seems like a disconnect from where I am sitting and if one hand has no idea what the other is doing, I would rather sit this one out.

Anyone know if the commies are doing the same thing on the HFT lifters?

[Formulas]

Currently there is no safe harbor anywhere and realistically things have been off the rails for a pretty long time ... In the early 90's I replaced a camshaft and lifters after dropping in the lifters I spun the oil pump with my reversable drill simply because I could, OMG copious amounts of glitter came running out of the top of the new lifters needless to say the horse was already out of the barn so I kept spinning the pump for a very long time before proceeding changed the filter prior to startup

[4dblnkldude]

OMG! I hope you get reimbursed somehow!

[JLMounce]

This is hot rodding unfortunately. The Johnson lifters are fairly well regarded, but nothing is fool proof.

Heck for GM and Toyota are going through it with engine failure on brand new stuff right now. Penny pinchers looking for the bottom line have gone too far in one direction and failure payouts are rising. We're due for a swing towards quality.

[hurryinhoosier62]

Originally Posted by JLMounce

This is hot rodding unfortunately. The Johnson lifters are fairly well regarded, but nothing is fool proof.

Heck for GM and Toyota are going through it with engine failure on brand new stuff right now. Penny pinchers looking for the bottom line have gone too far in one direction and failure payouts are rising. We're due for a swing towards quality.

Yep. As my old friend and mentor used to tell me “New does not necessarily mean good.” Either I’ve been lucky or what Bud taught me works!

[Shiny]

Originally Posted by JLMounce

.....Penny pinchers looking for the bottom line have gone too far in one direction and failure payouts are rising.

Agree! In my experience, this has been true for everything that sells competitively for at least 3 decades.

We're due for a swing towards quality.

I'm not holding my breath. Large businesses have an amazing ability to avoid spending money on quality and reliability. There are lots of "creative" ways to manage higher-than-planned losses that somehow appeal to companies more than the cost and time needed to assure those losses are low...

Yes, I'm an old cynical dinosaur.

Mike

[steve25]

In my line of daily work we have had a fair amount of gear that we have made by the red communist arrive with either defective or with a bad issue that we do not find out about until it has got into customer hands.

One time a cheaper inferior major part was used and we had replace these two parts in 800 units before we sold any more.

In a more recent occurrence the red communist factory that made the item of gear for us made a production change in a circuit board without telling us nor getting
our approval.
And that ended up with us having to disassemble 1100 items of gear to implement a correction.

Just recently we got to the other side of another production mess that took near 4 months to straighten out.

This is all on gear that the company I work for own the production and design rights on just to be clear.

And I could give plenty more examples.

If you get anything automotive that’s been made in China and it has been assembled there and you do not take it apart to check it out then I am not the least bit surprised that there are the failure rates taking place that have been reported.

If that black metallic **** that came out of those lifters was not found then the whole engine could have been lost.

[JLMounce]

Originally Posted by steve25

In my line of daily work we have had a fair amount of gear that we have made by the red communist arrive with either defective or with a bad issue that we do not find out about until it has got into customer hands.

One time a cheaper inferior major part was used and we had replace these two parts in 800 units before we sold any more.

In a more recent occurrence the red communist factory that made the item of gear for us made a production change in a circuit board without telling us nor getting
our approval.
And that ended up with us having to disassemble 1100 items of gear to implement a correction.

Just recently we got to the other side of another production mess that took near 4 months to straighten out.

This is all on gear that the company I work for own the production and design rights on just to be clear.

And I could give plenty more examples.

If you get anything automotive that’s been made in China and it has been assembled there and you do not take it apart to check it out then I am not the least bit surprised that there are the failure rates taking place that have been reported.

If that black metallic **** that came out of those lifters was not found then the whole engine could have been lost.

I think it's important to point out here that the lifters Tim was running are made here in the USA.

Morel lifters are primarily made here and in Mexico.

We have quality issues all over the place, regardless of the location of manufacture. China can produce really good products, the USA can produce really ****ty products. It's not either or.

It's definitely a good idea to check every component these days. With my recent engine build, I pad quite a bit extra to have their race prep engine assembly done, instead of basic machining and assembly. Hopefully I got my money's worth on that.

[Formulajones]

Made in the USA doesn't mean much anymore, clearly. And these aren't the higher quality Hy Lift Johnson's either. They are Johnson's, a different company known for making good quality flat tappets but usually not the higher quality rollers. Hence the reason they are $400-$500 cheaper.

They might be assembled here in the US or some other form or procedure but that doesn't necessarily mean all the parts and pieces were from here.