[unruhjonny]

this thread is always in the background of my mind, and I prefer to show examples instead of just text;

Can anyone tell me if this is 'Bermuda Blue'?
Because I don't recall seeing this hue on another 1970 Firebird.

https://www.hemmings.com/classifieds...1ac156ef962ef0

[unruhjonny]

this thread is always in the background of my mind, and I prefer to show examples instead of just text;

Can anyone tell me if this is 'Bermuda Blue'?
Because I don't recall seeing this hue on another 1970 Firebird.

1970 Formula 400; L78, M40, Light Blue

[Held for Ransom]

Originally Posted by unruhjonny

this thread is always in the background of my mind, and I prefer to show examples instead of just text;

Can anyone tell me if this is 'Bermuda Blue'?
Because I don't recall seeing this hue on another 1970 Firebird.

1970 Formula 400; L78, M40, Light Blue

Trim tag from said car.

[eaglesan13]

Exterior code 67, Castilian bronze with interior code 217 deluxe sandalwood.

[keith k]

That's not a factory color - looks like whoever painted it changed the color. From the paint visible in the trunk, my guess is it was originally Castillian Bronze (note this is a Van Nuys car, so that's not the red oxide e-coat, since they didn't apply that at VN in 1970).

[Held for Ransom]

Originally Posted by keith k

That's not a factory color - looks like whoever painted it changed the color. From the paint visible in the trunk, my guess is it was originally Castillian Bronze (note this is a Van Nuys car, so that's not the red oxide e-coat, since they didn't apply that at VN in 1970).

Agree.

[turbo69bird]

So is it a 70 or 71 can you tell

[turbo69bird]

Originally Posted by turbo69bird

So is it a 70 or 71 can you tell

added a couple extras

[turbo69bird]

Originally Posted by turbo69bird

added a couple extras

Having trouble adding these

[Baron Von Zeppelin]

Originally Posted by turbo69bird

So is it a 70 or 71 can you tell

71 Birds and Formulas had the fake grille on the fenders below the emblems.
And as mentioned appears to be low back 70 seats.

[turbo69bird]

Originally Posted by Baron Von Zeppelin

71 Birds and Formulas had the fake grille on the fenders below the emblems.
And as mentioned appears to be low back 70 seats.

It’s a little tricky, nose was fiberglass , seats were from herb Adams and were trans am racing series aluminum
seats originally Eckstrom told me they were trans am seats and I though what the heck is the difference trans am
Or formula . lol
I later found out it was trans am racing series seats

I’m
Not exactly sure if they went in when the car was first built by Stephen or after. I just know that herb came to CT and him
And Eckstrom went to lime rock park. He (Eckstrom) was also flown out to Pontiac to meet w Tom Nell that’s when they got involved in the RaV program , they already had the RAIv car and had the RaII car the year before.

Reason I ask about the year is because the car has been described by those who worked there as both 701/2 and 71 wasn’t sure if you guys who knew there year could tell
But what’s also tough about it is the car was updated a few times until I belive 73 season when they were bottled from the racing program because of an article that came
Out divulging factory involvement/ support in be racing program. Stephens thought they were playing it safe w the info and didn’t divulge nearly the support they had but apparently the factory was pissed as they took back some
Of their parts that were currently at diamond auto and told them they were out of the racing program
Eckstrom
(The driver and mechanic drive back to Stephens and quite on the spot. Apparently the owners son had given the info on the car not realizing how hush hush it was supposed to be.
Article was Rodder and super
Stock
Magazine by Joe oldham
Maybe Jan 72. Took a while for it to get back to the factory what exactly had happened though, I think .

The big issue was the info about the alluminum block and the intake Pontiac had supplied.

.

[johnta1]

No VIN in the car now?

[unruhjonny]

Thanks!
As it happens the gentleman called me(!);
I sent a note through the Hemmings listing (which required a phone number) saying I shared the listing, and that it would help his cause if he shared a picture of the cowl tag, or PHS (if he ran that).

He suggested it was Castillian Bronze and that the second owner did a repaint;
He seemed very forthright, and very friendly.
Apparently his first car was a ‘70 TA, and he’s selling this in the hopes of getting a TA.

Thanks for sharing the picture of the cowl tag - that confirms it was a Castillian Bronze car;
You guys are really sharp at seeing a tiny bit of the original paint in the truck - I missed that.

I made a passing comment about the added ram air stuff, and he thought it was all factory;
I can see the vacuum reservoir, which suggests it’s an L78 car - but I don’t know what he’s got the reservoir line going to..??

It’s a very nice looking car.

[Baron Von Zeppelin]

Originally Posted by unruhjonny

I made a passing comment about the added ram air stuff, and he thought it was all factory;
I can see the vacuum reservoir, which suggests it’s an L78 car - but I don’t know what he’s got the reservoir line going to..?.

Its a good representation of Bermuda Blue.
Has RA induction and RA exhaust - but #13 heads.
Most likely a YS engine.

[unruhjonny]

wait, does this car still exist?

[turbo69bird]

I have accumulated most of the parts from the car over the years even the gauges etc.. I don’t have the body but I do have most of the info to recreate it or identify it if it was found
However it was supposed to have been crushed by a local metal scrap yard because the front sub frame and an arms etc had been extensively acid dipped and were paper thin. Real question is did they actually scrap it. ( who knows)
The RAV pro stock engine is currently in my RAIv firebird , where we believe it was at least tested at one point before the 70 body’s got there. my car also got the RAV style shift light tach at ( what I can best figure) the beginning of 70 race season .can tell because for a short time the tach changed colors in the pictures which coincides w them getting the V parts from Pontiac and changing it

The 70 body hadn’t been delivered yet, and had a glass front end so the tach went on my car instead of the pro stock car ( sadly it came off in 1978 and I don’t have it) .
I’d like to find one of the repros someone made (HOBI I believe )
Anyway the two drivers for Stephens say the body was a 70 and a half but the article says it was a 71 so I figured I’d put it out there to you guys for fun and see if you noticed any gel take signs on the back half . It’s hard because the car was also update every year earliest picture I know of w a date on it was August of 70 ! I will eventually recreate it as best I can from
All the info and parts that I have .

I grew up 1 block away from Stephens original Pontiac dealership and knew both of the drivers .my dad and who brother knew most of the guys who worked there and worked on the cars and some salesmen. I also bought my first bird from this dealership new. I used to draw pictures of these cars on my note books in school �� and we rode our bikes through the dealership making vroom vroom noises pretending to be driving them

[unruhjonny]

It looks like I need to edit where the fuel gauge is - that should be a separate item (I'll fix it in my wordpad file) - odds are you observed like many others, an early 1971 model year car with "1970" parts.
EDIT: this should not be in the "honorable mention" category - I have this listed in the interior items as 'C14'

Regarding the armrest, I have personally taken apart a totally original 1970 base model which had the Camaro armrests;
I have died those door panels (were off white; painted black) for use in my car;
I have understood that the "Camaro" armrests were somewhat common in 1971 Firebirds.

['ol Pinion head]

"F17) 1970-1972 cars with ralley wheels used the same style lug nut used on 1967-1979 cars - they were a two piece chrome lugnut with a black plastic insert; service replacements were cast with the end hole covered, and black epoxy(?) which looked like hte older placstic cover."

RALLY wheels were used by Pontiac Motor Division

RALLEY wheels were a Chevrolet usage item.

Lugnuts w 4 3/4 bolt pattern Rally II wheels:
-'67-70 (& some very early '71 Firebirds) w Rally II wheels used the black plastic center lugnut. Same deal on '67-70 Pontais A-body's & '69-70 GrandPrixs.

Both black center & red center (aftermarket) lugnuts were manufactured & marketed by Motor Wheel. Dealerships sold the black centered ones in both 7/16" & 1/2" thread versions. Both color center lugnuts were also sold in MotorWheel packaging, in sets, by SpeedShops. With the black centered "Rally II" lug nuts first reproduced in the mid '80's, red center lug nuts were also brought to market. My take on the red center rally II lug nuts is they have a special place next to the aftermarket "Buick" aircleaner decals.

-'71 A, F, G, X-body's with RallyII's used the "tall cap" stainless steel capped 7/16" RH thread lugnut. These were discontinued by GM parts system in early '74. Not easy to find in nice used shape.

Of note, the "tall cap" stainless capped lugnut was introduced by Chevrolet for use on '69 & mid '70 14x7 SSI wheels (codes YA & AO), as well as the '70-72 Z-28 wheels. These "tall cap" stainless lugnuts were also installed on what must have been several hundred thousand Camaro's, ElCamino's, Malibus, & Novas up through the '72 production year when running the 14" 6 slot wheels. This style 14" wheel had 6 stainless window trim pieces & wore a big potmetal center cap.

-Short cap stainless capped lug nuts were introduced on the '73 model GM's & used by Pontiac up through the '81 models when equipped with Pontiac Rally II wheels. I bought this style new through local dealers up into the late 90's.

['ol Pinion head]

"F17) 1970-1972 cars with ralley wheels used the same style lug nut used on 1967-1979 cars - they were a two piece chrome lugnut with a black plastic insert; service replacements were cast with the end hole covered, and black epoxy(?) which looked like hte older placstic cover."

RALLY wheels were used by Pontiac Motor Division

RALLEY wheels were a Chevrolet usage item.

Lugnuts w 4 3/4 bolt pattern Rally II wheels:
-'67-70 (& some very early '71 Firebirds) w Rally II wheels used the black plastic center lugnut. Same deal on '67-70 Pontais A-body's & '69-70 GrandPrixs.

Both black center & red center (aftermarket) lugnuts were manufactured & marketed by Motor Wheel. Dealerships sold the black centered ones in both 7/16" & 1/2" thread versions. Both color center lugnuts were also sold in MotorWheel packaging, in sets, by SpeedShops. With the black centered lug nuts first reproduced in the mid '80's, red center lug nuts were also brought to market.

-'71 A, F, G, X-body's with RallyII's used the "tall cap" stainless steel capped 7/16" right hand thread lugnut. These were discontinued by GM parts system in early '74.

The "tall cap" stainless capped lugnut was introduced by Chevrolet for use on '69 & mid '70 14x7 SSI wheels (codes YA & AO), as well as the '70-72 Z-28 wheels. These "tall cap" stainless lugnuts were also installed on what must have been several hundred thousand Camaro's, ElCamino's, Malibus, & Novas up through the '72 production year when running the 14" 6 slot wheels. This style 14" wheel had 6 stainless window trim pieces & wore a big potmetal center cap.

-Short cap stainless capped lug nuts were introduced on the '73 model GM's & used by Pontiac up through the '81 models when equipped with Pontiac Rally II wheels. I bought this style new through local dealers up into the late 90's.

[Baron Von Zeppelin]

Just an off-the-shelf tidbit on 70 low back seats .

A local friend replaced his rusted out frames with 69 F-Body repop frames.
The headrest slots were direct fit also.
He had to have springs made by a local manufacturer - I believe for the bottoms.

None of the repop tracks are right , he ordered 2 or 3 variations.
Think he said the 69 tracks are closest , and is modifying those.

I can get more info if anyone needs more details.