[dmac]

Are there any new simpler smarter EFI systems on the market in the last year or so? There was a flurry starting about 2 years ago of lower cost systems, I haven't seen anything new on the forum recently.

The new cheaper aluminum heads and a cheaper alternative to the $1000+ efi, plus hundreds more for EFI tank/pump all maybe in a kit would be nice.

A throttle body with an internal pump to pressurize the injectors would make it easy to convert while still using the mechanical pump. There should be some way to incorporate a sensor to eliminate the need for a separate pressure regulator and return,

[Navy Horn 16]

No.

[newmexguy]

Don't see a problem with a carburetor other than the ethanol they put in fuel nowadays.

[1967Tempest]

Edelbrock Pro Flo 4??

[Navy Horn 16]

Originally Posted by 1967Tempest

Edelbrock Pro Flo 4??

LoL. It's like $1700 and doesn't include fuel pump or tank. And it only supports 550hp.

[72projectbird]

Fuel injection use to be super expensive 10ish years ago. Simple setups were often around 3k. Now we have numerous offerings for about $800-1500.

I'd say we're in the golden age of cheap fuel injection.

[JLMounce]

The complete cost of the FiTech I put on my wife’s car was right at 1500.00. That’s a FiTech GoStreet, Tanks Inc tank with a walbro 190 lb/hr fuel pump, new fuel lines and filter.

This is for all new components.

If you don’t have an issue buying slightly used you can do it a bit cheaper.

If you need to fuel more than 400hp it starts getting a bit more expensive, about 200 more for a 600hp capable unit and about 50 more for a bigger pump.

[JLMounce]

Originally Posted by Navy Horn 16

LoL. It's like $1700 and doesn't include fuel pump or tank. And it only supports 550hp.

It can support about as much power is you want. The problem is Edelbrock doesn’t make that process convenient. What you have to do is purchase the system. Then purchase the injectors you need for your application over 550hp. Then you return the injectors provided in their original packaging and they’ll refund the difference from the injectors you purchased.

You change the injectors flow rate in the software.

For a system that includes a cam sync distributor, torker ii intake manifold, 1000cfm throttle body, fuel rails, injectors and an ecu developed and manufactured by a higher end engine management company, you actually get quite a lot for that 1700.00

[64speed]

My Holley Sniper with Dual Sync distributor and matching EFI fuel tank with lines and filter cost about 1800

[Steve C.]

The all new FiTech Force Fuel System makes the upgrade to fuel injection even easier. The Force Fuel simply connects to a stock mechanical or electric fuel pump then supplies the EFI system with high pressure through the use of an internal 340-LPH pump. This means you don’t need to run a new feed line from the tank.

https://fitechefi.com/products/force-fuel-system/


( Information provided in this post does not represent a product endorsement. And unless specified it is not based on personal experience and is offered for general interest only )


.

[Scarebird]

Originally Posted by Navy Horn 16

LoL. It's like $1700 and doesn't include fuel pump or tank. And it only supports 550hp.

$1,700 for port fuel injection - which means you get the manifold, rails, ECM, etc AND a computer controlled distributor too?

not a bad deal.

You can run a secondary tank instead of a FI gas tank.

[Formulajones]

The only EFI I'm even considering is the Holley Sniper Stealth simply because it looks like a holley carb and it's the only one I can stand to look at. Plus I can do a couple things with it to basically hide the fact it's EFI and no one would even be the wiser.

I do agree with Dmac though, it's not really that cheap compared to others. Our problem is I need the system to support 700+ HP so the cheaper kits that peak at 650hp and down, just won't work.

The Sniper Stealth is about $1600+ when you get into that HP range. I'll bite and make the plunge though, as long as it performs as well as I'm reading. The price goes up even more if you want it to control a 4L80E though. It's almost cheaper to buy a separate controller for the trans. That part hasn't even been mentioned yet. How many want transmission control too?

As far as the fuel systems go, I really don't view that as an extra cost, simply because any car worth it's weight where the owner needs to upgrade the fuel delivery system before even thinking about EFI, should already have an in tank pump with 1/2" feed and return lines to feed that carb. That's simply just the proper way to do it if you want to feed these 450-500hp (and beyond) engines properly. Yeah I know it's expensive. I've done more than a couple of these fuel system upgrades as of late, and they'll run you about $1200 when it's all said and done, but in my opinion it's the best, quietest, and most reliable fuel system upgrade that'll feed ridiculous power, just choose your pump, and the best part when it's all done, it all looks stock with no funky fuel tanks and pumps mounted up front in the engine bay taking up space.

I'm doing one of my own cars with a Tanks Inc setup as we speak, then it'll get a Sniper Stealth unit in the near future. I'm even considering doing another Tanks Inc setup on one of our daily drivers, simply because I've had a bad run of new mechanical pumps lately that took me 3 tries to get a good one. I'm starting to not trust them these days anymore and I don't want to run into that issue when I'm 500 miles from home either.

[72projectbird]

Summit Racing now makes their own efi unit for $750. Supposed to support 500hp.

If we're talking cheap efi, it's not getting much lower than that. Should work fine for a cruiser.

[Formulajones]

That's when I start wondering, how cheap is cheap enough and when does cheap start rewarding you with diminishing returns?

[JLMounce]

Originally Posted by 72projectbird

Summit Racing now makes their own efi unit for $750. Supposed to support 500hp.

If we're talking cheap efi, it's not getting much lower than that. Should work fine for a cruiser.

This is actually a FiTech unit. Just doesn't have the on-throttle body ecu. The hardware, software etc. is all FiTech stuff, made for summit.

I've heard it's a decent package though.

Originally Posted by Formulajones

That's when I start wondering, how cheap is cheap enough and when does cheap start rewarding you with diminishing returns?

On both the FiTech and Holley Sniper stuff, there are already areas that are being cut to shave cost. Some of the sensors are OE replacement stuff and especially the water temp sensors don't really make the grade on either unit, out of the box.

Both provide a cheap mounting solution for the oxygen sensor that isn't very good and realistically should only be used to get you to a muffler shop where it can be welded in place.

That item specifically I think causes them a lot of support headaches because if that o2 sensor is seeing fresh air, the system just won't run correctly. But it's something they can advertise as no-weld which in the purchaser's eyes is a bit less money they have to spend.

As it is I don't think you're going to see these units get cheaper and I'm of the opinion, you probably wouldn't want to see them getting cheaper.

What you can do however, is cruise the sniper and fitech boards and groups. There's always people that just purchased, either didn't use it at all, or barely used it and decided to go in a different direction. Or they purchased too small and up-sized etc.

You can get low or no usage stuff for cheaper going that direction if you're straining your budget a bit.

[Formulajones]

I agree I also don't think the units will get cheaper, only more expensive.

I'm also not a fan of the strap on 02's, and never liked them the first time I set eye's on them. I keep a box of 02 bungs here for my wideband, and always weld them in, so that strap on 02 that comes with a lot of these kits was never really even a concern for me, that would have been tossed in the trash anyway.

I also don't really have a problem if a kit has a subpar or cheap sensor that may or may not be accurate. Sensors are pretty cheap to buy and easy to replace anyway. I'm more focused about the real bones of the unit as far as the computer processor, the tuning options it has and it's abilities, as well as the appearance of a carb that looks the part. All the other stuff is minor. I usually find myself upgrading these so called kits anyway whether it be a trans swap or whatever, because there is always something in them that I don't really care for on my stuff.

What I'm waiting for is a call back or response from Holley. I have yet to see someone that has bought the 700+ hp units and attempted to run them on a 600hp engine. I was more interested in whether it had the ability to adapt to a lesser engine in the mean time without the need to change injectors and all that monkey business.

[JLMounce]

You shouldn't have any issues in that regard. The injector duty cycle at idle may be a bit lower than optimal, but this is less of a concern with the anular discharge ring vs a port injection system where injector spray pattern is more critical.

I have a 600hp FiTech unit on my 455 and while the package I run should be a bit north of 500hp at sea level, it's probably 420ish up here at altitude. I don't see any ill-effects from this even though injector flow rates are under 4% at idle.

I'm not certain how Holley handles this, but I do know the FiTech units with 8 injectors (1200PA and MeanStreet) utilize only 4 injectors under normal driving until TPS or KPA get's high enough to warrant the extra fuel, then the additional injectors fire.

[Skip Fix]

I think probably for me the most critical issue is going to be how "user friendly" is the software? Kind of like any computer software you use-is it easy for my expertise level?

Heck I have a NIB old Holley TBI system I'll almost give away and an older FAST sequential wiring and computer that was the hot stuff back in the day I never used but is above my brain level to use I'd sell for cheap. But as with factory cars newer is going to use a faster computer and they have finally geared the software to more "self tuning".

I do like the new system that looks like a Holley-would like it better if the dichromated it to really look like one!

[GTO JONES]

I think if I find out the Holley sniper software supports or can control a 4L80E I'll be sold on it. It already supports up to 1250 hp so it says. Any body knows chime in.

[Formulajones]

Originally Posted by Skip Fix

I do like the new system that looks like a Holley-would like it better if the dichromated it to really look like one!

They do make it with the gold dichromate, that's the one I'm getting. With a fake fuel line and fuel pump, and the air cleaner installed, it looks like a carb to everyone that walks by.

https://youtu.be/lwxahWUDzAc