[Tiberius]

Okay I have Hooker Super competition Ceramic coated hedders on my 75 TA
and How in the Heck do you tighten them?

You have to be a contosionist inorder the get that puny 5/16 wrench around that bolt which cannot fit some bolts as they are embedded right in the corner of the folds where the hedder pipe exists the heads.

One bolt in particular is hard to get at.

The middle drivers side which is impossible to get at.

I even jacked up the car and toke the wheel off for access.
I asked the mechanic "How in the Heck did you tighten it?"
I Think I might have to shave the head of the wrench or cut the wrench in half to make it short and stubby.

Anyways anyone else have a suggestion.

Do they make like a flex head wrench or something? LOL

[Mr. P-Body]

Remove the starter and jack the ENGINE up. Use a SHORT open-end wrench. Come at it from "behind". You can do it...

Jim

[David Jones]

I'm able to tighten all of mine but one with a Craftsman line wrench. That one is on the passenger side, on one of the middle ports. I use a regular open end on it.

[HWYSTR455]

You're obviously talking about D-ports! Heh-heh! I made 3 wrenches to do this task (before I went to round ports), and it takes a curved one, a 90 degree angled one, and a long one with the 'big' side of the open end ground some. You can use a piece of string or something tied around your wrist and the one end of the wrench that you hold, so, when in that 'contorted' position, if you drop it, you won't have to climb under the car to retrieve it! Do a search, I at one time posted a pic of the wrench-arsenal.

http://forums.maxperformanceinc.com/...eader+wrenches The one farthest to the right is the one that will tighten the driver center-rear bolt.

I used to 'doctor' the Hookers and Headmans before installing them, using an old 3/4 socket and a big hammer, holding it up to the 'known problem areas' and beating the crap out of them. Since they generally hung low, and I ground the heck out of them on a fairly regular basis, I never bought coated ones, and would just replace them every 2 years or so. Well, headers then were like between 100-175 bucks max too! I remember buying Headmans for $69.95! And that really wasn't that long ago!


.

[Tiberius]

Guys,

Thanks for the suggestions. and yes it's a D port head #62's

I'll remove the starter and jack up the engine and try that.

Also the angled/curved open end wrenches sound like a good idea.

Anyone sell them? LOL

[HWYSTR455]

I really don't think jacking the engine will help, since I believe the flange is in the way, or that's always been my thoughts. I've tried everything, believe me! Cutting the flange only makes them warp faster, which makes them leak and blow gaskets more, meaning, you're changing gaskets more.

Here's some choices of angled wrenches, though there's many places you can find them:

http://www.sears.com/shc/s/search_10...nches&sLevel=0


You can also try changing over to the ARP 3/8" head bolts, might help some. I had to grind the tops of the heads shorter to allow them to slip in in a couple places though, kind of pointless.

.

["QUICK-SILVER"]

TOOLS:
Many can be got with flex head sockets from underneath.
A good assortment of box end/open ends is a must.
And one more that I'll try to get a pic up later. It's a 50 year old club foot made by Williams. Probably one of the first flank drive tools ever made. Where a regular open end wont get the bolt tight enough, this one you can put a cheater pipe on.

TIME:
Just plan on it taking a while and don't rush it. Walk away and rest your hands regularly.

Frame of mind:
It's a royal pain and you know it. It's something you want for the car not something it's got to have. So dont get ticked when things dont go right. Treat it like any other project, do the best you can and then some.


Getting the bolts tight enough is what it's all about. So use a box end whenever possible and dont be afraid to use a pry bar and block of wood to put extra pressure on the wrench. Especially when you're in a spot that your hand barely will fit.

[abefromen]

Originally Posted by HWYSTR455

Cutting the flange only makes them warp faster, which makes them leak and blow gaskets more, meaning, you're changing gaskets more.


.

thats odd..my experience has been just the opposite. Removing the flanges between the ports has helped reduce the chances of leaks not to mention making it a bit easier to get to the bolts. Did this on a '66 GTO and never had a leak in over 5 years. I know the guy who has the car now and it still runs the same headers!

Anyone else had good/bad results doing this?

[stickboy]

I cut the flange on the drivers side, but no the pass (why? I don't know but...)

The drivers side is on it's 2nd gasket in 4 years, the passenger on it's 6th....plus it is a LOT easier to actually get to the bolt. Next time it is out of the car, I'm gonna cut the pass side too.

A set of ignition wrenches helps a lot, they have 90 degree heads, but they are small so the torque applied is limited.

But headers on a Pontiac still SUCK!

[HWYSTR455]

Hm, well, yeah, that's been my experience, that they (the tubes) tend to move around once they're cut, and starting all the bolts in some cases can be impossible, so I never cut the flanges again. Guess might just depend on the flange or header?

I cut the gaskets into individual pieces, and notch the bolt holes in the gasket open,so I can side the pieces in on the ports without taking the bolts out, but don't think that's any revelation. Would imagine most would have figured that one out!

Passenger side headers always blow gaskets more frequently. Why? Because that's the header that hangs down more, and making contact puts a load on the header where it meets the head, ie, the gasket. That too has always been my thinking.

QS- Oh you are sooo right! It's a royal pita, and the rigth frame of mind is required! I know I've actually had engine install projects stall from having to go out into the yard to look for a wrench I pitched in a fit of rage! Heh-heh! On a set that's been on the car before, doctored, I had it down to about 45 mins a side, which, only people who know, would know that's pretty darn good!


.

[HWYSTR455]

Another tid-bit on D-port header bolt tightening - Bolts for ports 1 and 5, and sometimes 2 and 6 passenger, need to be the first bolts started, and tightened before fully tightening any other bolts. If you don't, they make contact with tubes when you tighten the other bolts, making it next to impossible to turn them. That too I believe is no revelation, and most will figured it out the first time, but thought it would be worth mentioning!


.

[75TA]

I also have Hooker Super competition Ceramic coated headers on my 75 TA. For the driver side middle, I cut a wrench so I could turn it more to go in between the tubes. I also go through the wheel well and when it starts to get tight, I use a hammer handle to push on the wrench (wood handle hammer). Its tough, but it can be done.

[Pontirag]

No body seems to mention saftey wiring the bolts to keep them tight. I drill holes in my bolts then snug every thing up warm up the engine and after it cools off enough to touch I snug it up some more and then safety wire it. You might want to check to see if the flange is actually flat

[HWYSTR455]

I've seen people safety wire and use those bolts with the locks on them, but they need to be re-tightened over time as the gasket compresses. Sometimes as much as a 1/4 turn or more, which the safety wire can't account for. The locks you can pull off and put back on, but I've seen where you can't get them clocked right in order to hold the bolt. My experiences/observations, though I could be wrong....


.

[Pontirag]

I never could understand how those lock thingies work. I work the aerospace industry so safety wire is second nature

[HWYSTR455]

Safety wire is a great thing, and I've done some in the aircraft side. One thing I hate is drilling bolts! Can't always find the pre-drilled ones when you need one, and the jigs that hold the bolts to drill are a pita!



.

[AGTO8U]

I became so frustrated with tightening headers in my early days of Pontiacs, I deliberately put a flip front end on a 67 GTO primarily just to have easier access to the header bolts! Had to tighten them every month back then on a daily driver. It wasn't until I began cutting the flanges between the exhaust ports that regular tigtening ceased. With full flanges, if the header flanges are not perfectly flat, it will not seal properly. I have seen many a header flange that is not perfectly flat, and in some cases the head surface not flat. With cut flanges pressure is concentrated to each individual port rather than spread over all the ports. Since you already have the headers on the car, your probably stuck with trying to tighten the best you can with modified wrenches dedicated for header bolts. You can also grind a header bolt down for added clearance in the corners. FWIW, I've been cutting header flanges between the exhaust ports for the past 20 years and "glue" the header gaskets to each flange with RTV silicone prior to installing and letting dry overnight. Never had a problem with sealing and the bolts stay tight.

[F ROCK]

my header wrench.

[HWYSTR455]

The trick to bending the wrench is understanding that the wrench doesn't really exist....



.

[old66tiger]

AGTO8U....good idea. I don't have headers yet, but that looks like a really good idea. I wonder how hard it is to make sure the ports are aligned on assembly? How much bigger are the bolt holes as compared to the bolts?