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#1
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Front control arms
Has anyone tried dynacorn front control arms? My 72 GTO needs the front suspension rebuilt and price is reasonable for the arms, about $100 each. I cant find a shop to press out the bushings and with the cost of bushings and ball joints, it's close to the same price? Any other mfgs that are good? I like moog but they do not make the arms.
Mark |
#2
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I have not heard or seen any information about these, but there's a decent chance they suffer from the same issues you find with the Global West knockoffs. Namely that the construction of the arm itself is fine, but that the components installed (bushings and ball joints) are of extremely suspect quality.
It's probably the ball joints in this case that I'd maybe check a little further into.
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-Jason 1969 Pontiac Firebird |
#3
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You can rent one of those C clamp style 'front end tools' or even buy one fairly cheap, they do come in handy for a number of jobs.
This is Eastwood's press, $72, pretty sure it's a rebranded OTC: https://www.eastwood.com/eastwood-4-...yABEgJpTvD_BwE I agree, I would never trust the ball joints in any suspension part as-shipped, unless it's from a well-know aftermarket supplier. I've heard comments on the aftermarket factory repop control arms, from a handful of sources, that they are 'generic', and are listed for a number of different apps. You kind of won't know until you actually go to align the car, and by then, you will be cussin' up a storm. Dynacorn is kind of hit or miss on some parts, and I can't say exactly whether the control arms fit in that category, but if the arms you have aren't damaged or worn out, I'd say reuse them. If they are worn out, damaged, etc, (ball joint loose-fit is common on lowers, for example), then I would say go to an aftermarket 'performance' arm instead of a 'replacement' one. .
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. 1970 GTO Judge Tribute Pro-Tour Project 535 IA2 http://forums.maxperformanceinc.com/...d.php?t=760624 1971 Trans Am 463, 315cfm E-head Sniper XFlow EFI, TKO600 extreme, 9", GW suspension, Baer brakes, pro tour car https://forums.maxperformanceinc.com...ght=procharger Theme Song: http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=7zKAS...ature=youtu.be |
#4
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Having just done that same job on my 67, my advice would be to just have someone else do it. No matter what parts you decide to use. Though I would say that having a complete arm, either tubular or stamped that was brand new would have eliminated about 60% of the headache.
I asked the guy who aligned my car how much he would charge and he said probably 3-400. Once I was hot and dirty trying to do mine with Oreileys borrowed and beat up loaner tools that was missing pieces I was really beating myself up for trying to save a few hundred dollars. I do a lot of work on my own cars and that job sucked. A lot.
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1967 Firebird 462 580hp/590ftlbs 1962 Pontiac Catalina Safari Swapped in Turd of an Olds 455 Owner/Creator Catfish Motorsports https://www.youtube.com/@CatfishMotorsports |
#5
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Quote:
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-Jason 1969 Pontiac Firebird |
#6
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$72 for tools, $280 for a set of knock-off arms, maybe $100 for ball joints, and you have the tools, plus new tubular arms with bushings, for the price of someone else doing it for you. AND, you know it was done right.
No matter how you choose to do it, you will still have to buy the ball joints. If you choose to do the bushings too, which would make sense since it's apart, the cost gap is in your favor w new arms. Here's the go-to knock off arms: https://www.ebay.com/itm/15439882673...3ABFBM8NWVxJ9g Would be a good time to clean those areas up too, and inspect for any potential damage. Just deductible reasoning, it's obviously your choice. .
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. 1970 GTO Judge Tribute Pro-Tour Project 535 IA2 http://forums.maxperformanceinc.com/...d.php?t=760624 1971 Trans Am 463, 315cfm E-head Sniper XFlow EFI, TKO600 extreme, 9", GW suspension, Baer brakes, pro tour car https://forums.maxperformanceinc.com...ght=procharger Theme Song: http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=7zKAS...ature=youtu.be |
#7
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The repop arms I got a few years ago were horrible. Sent them back. Ball joint angle was all wrong, metal was thinner, very little reinforcing around the ball joint. Ended up restoring my originals (which had been cut for larger shocks) and using those.
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I'm World's Best Hyperbolist !! |
#8
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Quote:
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. 1970 GTO Judge Tribute Pro-Tour Project 535 IA2 http://forums.maxperformanceinc.com/...d.php?t=760624 1971 Trans Am 463, 315cfm E-head Sniper XFlow EFI, TKO600 extreme, 9", GW suspension, Baer brakes, pro tour car https://forums.maxperformanceinc.com...ght=procharger Theme Song: http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=7zKAS...ature=youtu.be |
The Following User Says Thank You to HWYSTR455 For This Useful Post: | ||
#9
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LOL I found out that's how they are building a lot of the newer vehicles today. Back when I needed upper ball joints on my 05 duramax I found that was a job they didn't recommend attempting. They make the factory control arms so flimsy that pressing the ball joints in and out generally distorts the A-arm to the point it's not safe to use anymore and they sometimes even crack around the ball joint as a result. They are basically considered throw away items. The only alternative are brand new upper control arms complete with bushings and ball joints and just do a complete R&R. They don't make much you can rebuild these days, just remove and replace.
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#10
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Quote:
EPA and NHTSA regulations, combined with the electronic pork that everyone wants has added so much weight to the automobile that they are scrounging everywhere they can in an attempt to make a fuel economy target.
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-Jason 1969 Pontiac Firebird |
#11
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Hey dataway:
Who made those a arms? Thanks, Mario64 |
#12
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I would echo the sentiments above and stay far away from cheap control arms & ball joints. I got burned in that area with a different car a number of years ago. I installed a cheap kit including control arms, tie rod ends, and sway links, and literally every rubber boot failed (cracked open) within 2 weeks and the ball joints themselves failed with less than 5k miles on them. Got a warranty refund and replaced them with name brand parts and haven't had any problems since. When it comes to suspension components, you usually get what you pay for. You also have to recognize the limitations of online reviews. You may find a super cheap set of control arms that has great reviews, but people typically review products right after they install the parts, not after they have 5k, 10k, 20k miles on them.
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1966 Pontiac GTO (restoration thread) 1998 BMW 328is (track rat) 2023 Subaru Crosstrek Limited (daily) View my photos: Caught in the Wild |
#13
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The one link for control arms I posted are the ones that used to be carried by Right Stuff Detailing, and those are the good ones, minus the ball joints.
They've been on the 442 for around 40k miles, no issues whatsoever. You can search here, many have run them for a long time, after replacing the ball joints. Some went to them after they had issues with the factory repop arms, just to say. Now there are other aftermarket tubular arms that are junk, just look for the ones that are pictured in the listing for the link posted and you will be fine. (of course, after you replace the ball joints) .
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. 1970 GTO Judge Tribute Pro-Tour Project 535 IA2 http://forums.maxperformanceinc.com/...d.php?t=760624 1971 Trans Am 463, 315cfm E-head Sniper XFlow EFI, TKO600 extreme, 9", GW suspension, Baer brakes, pro tour car https://forums.maxperformanceinc.com...ght=procharger Theme Song: http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=7zKAS...ature=youtu.be |
#14
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I had the summit branded global west copies on my wife's Chevelle and the arms themselves were fine. The finish was good, they were the proper size and orientation, welds were good. The ball joints were lousy and the delrin bushings were loose in the housings. From a performance standpoint the bushings were fine, they were just noisy as a result of the tolerances.
As ZeGermanHam mentions, the problem is that a lot of these components out there that are lower cost are built with sub-par parts that don't last. Most people building these cars may put a 1000 miles on the car a year, so the parts are well past the warranty. It's cheaper for the manufacturer to deal with the few claims that come in then to provide the product with quality parts. There's a reason that quality "entry level" arms like BMR are still a good bit more expensive than the knock-offs. Even then, you're still getting a lot of polyurethane, which isn't the best choice for suspension components. You want high durometer rubber or delrin. If you look at the delrin bushings found in the knock-offs compared to arms like Global West, SPC, DSE etc. you'll notice that there's about 3X the amount of delrin in the higher priced arms. It's my opinion that it is largely the subpar delrin bushings found in the knockoffs that have caused the internet to claim that they are noisy and harsh. You're more or less riding on a steel cartridge with about a 1/4" of nylon as a cushion with those things.
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-Jason 1969 Pontiac Firebird |
#15
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I just rebuild the stock control arms here. It's not all that bad. A good press makes pretty easy work of it.
I would, (and do) just rebuild your originals before I'd purchase a set of aftermarket stock stamped steel pieces. I haven't been overly impressed with what I've seen on the stamped steel stuff, but you've figured that out already based on the comments it's pretty obvious. Of course if you want to go tubular then that's a different story. Pick yourself up a cheap press at Harbor Freight for the job, it'll come in handy for many other things down the road. |
#16
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We raced Dirt Modifieds for several years. We would search junk yards for Stock 68-72 lower control arms all the time. Aftermarket ones were cheap and available. The ball joints didn't fit as well, the car was more difficult to align, and one small racing incident would damage them. The stock arms are much better and much stronger Period! For me it's Stock Arms with good ball joints and Delrin bushings, or good quality tubular arms.
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Who cares about the horsepower wars, Indians win the torque wars. Roger |
#17
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Roger:
Thank you for that info. I am leaning towards getting a used set and rebuild them to reduce down time. What are the years and models that are a fit to my 64 grand prix? I will start looking for a rebuildable set of uppers & lowers. Anybody have suggestions? Ciao, Mario64 |
#18
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Even some pretty big problems can be fixed. After seeing the repops I decided to go ahead and repair my lowers that ..uhhh.. "someone" who might have had the same initials as me, cut open many years ago for a larger shock.
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I'm World's Best Hyperbolist !! |
#19
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I just paid Goodyear $200 (cash) to one of their mechanics to strip my old A arms. Next I have to get them powder coated, cheaper than sandblasting them and painting them myself. Taller ball joints will be another $100. I already had Moog bushings. Paint like $40 here a while ago.
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#20
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Yikes!! $200 to clean them up?
I just toss them in the blasting cabinet and hit them with glass bead, they come out looking brand new and only takes 20-30 minutes. Maybe I should just do that for a living, $400 an hour sounds pretty good |
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